It's been a while but now is the time

[koimatsuba 0]

Hi all

Yes I have decided to come out from the woodwork and give you all my opinion of the current situation at our beloved Norwich.

Well I''ve seen a lot of crap before in the last 30 years of supporting city and to be honest AN is not the worst we have ever had.

However he has lost his way and I believe that himself and a few players need to move on and we give the role to another head.

Don''t get me wrong AN has done a great job when he first came with a high win rate, unbeaten away from home for a long time. However an inexperienced Prem season and now a period of everyone knows his tactics and how City Panic under any pressure. We have been found out.

I think it''s time, please don''t let the board do what City always do which is wait too long then take weeks to get another guy in. Why can''t we do this now? Give the new manager 2 weeks of transfer window and change the captain and start to believe that the 8 points to 6th is easy.

We shouldn''t loose to Rotherham! 56 goals concieded and yet we lost again. 10 men or not, a draw minimum was required. But no another defeat.

My only issue is the replacement Manager if it should ever happen? Who?

Who would Norwich attract?

Time again will tell, top 6 or middle table boredom!?

Are Ipswich really just 3 points below now? And they are having a nightmare season!

Cmon Delia, wake up. Let''s have 20 games of belief not dispare and same old after game excuses!

On the ball!

Cheers All.

[im spartacus canary 0]

Thanks for that just what the forum needed 👍

[Cantiaci Canary 610]

It will be all change after the Wolves game with Hodgson''s appointment to follow ... I guess.

[Cantiaci Canary 610]

But, I''m genuinely surprised that Neil wasn''t fired after losing to bottom side Rotherham after the horrendous run we''ve been on of late.

If we are abandoning the aim of going hell for leather for promotion this season and switching to a longer term plan of rebuilding with AN taking a Dario Gradi type of role then the board should have informed the supporters.

If we haven''t switched objectives then how can you explain AN''s continued employment ... other than that the board have lost the plot!

[morty 0]

Alex Neil really isn''t the worst manager we have ever had.

[Feedthewolf 5,885]

[quote user="morty"]Alex Neil really isn''t the worst manager we have ever had.[/quote]Think you may have misread the OP, old bean... [:)]

[morty 0]

[quote user="Feedthewolf"][quote user="morty"]Alex Neil really isn''t the worst manager we have ever had.[/quote]Think you may have misread the OP, old bean... [:)][/quote]Ah, correct, I have.*goes to get another coffee*

[hogesar 10,761]

I don''t think anyone said he was on this thread at least Morty!

Saying that, he has managed to out-do some of our poorer managers when you consider the squad he''s got to work with. Would Peter Grant have lost 9 in 13?

Actually, don''t answer that.

[morty 0]

[quote user="hogesar"]I don''t think anyone said he was on this thread at least Morty!

Saying that, he has managed to out-do some of our poorer managers when you consider the squad he''s got to work with. Would Peter Grant have lost 9 in 13?

Actually, don''t answer that.[/quote]Yep, I misread it, see above."The squad he has got to work with" is an interesting point. Because I have been banging the drum for a long while that the players are letting us down as much, if not more, than Alex Neil is.The squad may look good on paper, but their mental fragility is costing us.

[Cantiaci Canary 610]

We also don''t have enough (any?) blood and thunder battlers. Could Gary O''Neil have made a big difference?

We melt in the face of adversity.

[king canary 8,750]

@Morty

He''s had two years, three transfer windows and fifty million quid to spend- if the squad is still mentally fragile then that is his fault.

[Midlands Yellow 4,682]

Beyond caring now . At least people are starting to realise a whole new regime is needed at this club .

I think there''s a few now who wouldn''t another humiliation next Saturday so the protagonist gets her fair share of abuse when the crowd finally wake up.

Good time to be a casual and not be tempted to waste a few hundred watching this car crash .

[morty 0]

[quote user="king canary"]@Morty

He''s had two years, three transfer windows and fifty million quid to spend- if the squad is still mentally fragile then that is his fault.[/quote]I don''t entirely agree.I said on another thread that the business of balancing a squad, whilst you are at constant thread of relegation, is a very, very difficult thing.The ideal situation is what Newcastle did, and mostly get shot of the players that got you relegated, but they had the luxury of having a lot more saleable assets than we have, so had the money to do it. Also they have the image, and the manager, to be able to attract virtually any player in the Championship / lower Premiership, to join them.Imagine the absolute state we''d be in, if we didn''t at least have the prospect of some Brady money coming in.I think the plan is very much to build for the future, looking at our investment in youth, and up and coming players, but it looks like we are going to have to be patient unfortunately.

[BroadstairsR 2,273]

I just visited TWTD for the first time in a while. One thread alludes to the fact that they are now only three points behind us.

A club £80m in debt with 15, 000 crowds and a squad made up of cheapies, freebies and loanees. as opposed to ours with three £8m+ players and several others who cost a few bob and, as someone has stated, run by a manager who has spent £50m.

It has led them to the mantra that money doesn''t guarantee

success. They always fall back on this as they have no choice, but I see it as more an indictment of Alex Neil''s uselessness.

Where would McCarthy have our lot by now?

[BroadstairsR 2,273]

Did Pritchard cost £8m too? I was referring to Niasmith, Timms and Brady.

I suppose Pritchard and Dolly were mostly paid for from the Redmond money.

Sell to buy.

[king canary 8,750]

I get that. But I think the mental fragility has been an issue in the squad for awhile and I don''t think Neil has addressed this in his signings.

Klose mentioned after the Liverpool game I think that he was surprised by the lack of on pitch leadership. I don''t think any of our summer signings went any way to addressing that and I don''t think yo-yoing between leagues prevents us signing players with the toughness/leadership skills we need.

Also we had quite a few saleable assets this summer. We cashed in on Redmond but I think if we''d have wanted to we could have moved on Brady, Klose, Olsson and others. It seemed to me that there was a calculated gamble by those at the club to try and keep this squad together as it was capable of bouncing straight back up.

[morty 0]

[quote user="king canary"]I get that. But I think the mental fragility has been an issue in the squad for awhile and I don''t think Neil has addressed this in his signings.

Klose mentioned after the Liverpool game I think that he was surprised by the lack of on pitch leadership. I don''t think any of our summer signings went any way to addressing that and I don''t think yo-yoing between leagues prevents us signing players with the toughness/leadership skills we need.

Also we had quite a few saleable assets this summer. We cashed in on Redmond but I think if we''d have wanted to we could have moved on Brady, Klose, Olsson and others. It seemed to me that there was a calculated gamble by those at the club to try and keep this squad together as it was capable of bouncing straight back up.[/quote]I think the mental fragility is a collective thing, and not just down to specific individuals though.One player that probably sums up the situation is Bradley Johnson. Mentally tough, but not good enough, quality wise, for the Premiership, so we got rid. It would have shown a real lack of ambition relying on a player like him, after we got promoted, and I suspect the club would have received criticsm if they had done so.The whole thing is a calculated gamble though, unless you have deep pockets (see Newcastle).

[hogesar 10,761]

I think most fans were wanting us to keep the majority of the squad together at the start of the season. Clearly the board did too.

Thankfully us fans don''t make the decisions and regardless, we''re not privy to all the information they have.

It looks like collectively the board have got it wrong this season, along with the manager. And they deserve the flack that goes with it.

[morty 0]

[quote user="hogesar"]I think most fans were wanting us to keep the majority of the squad together at the start of the season. Clearly the board did too.

Thankfully us fans don''t make the decisions and regardless, we''re not privy to all the information they have.

It looks like collectively the board have got it wrong this season, along with the manager. And they deserve the flack that goes with it.[/quote]See my comparisons with Newcastle though, Norwich City simply don''t have the luxury they do, to completely turn things round in a short time.I don''t like it any more than anyone else does, but I do have a certain sympathy for the situation.

[hogesar 10,761]

Oh, there''s no chance of us being able to do it to the extent of Newcastle but there were still opportunities to offload Brady and Klose which could have reportedly given us £20+ million plus the prem-level wages to alter the squad accordingly.

[morty 0]

[quote user="hogesar"]Oh, there''s no chance of us being able to do it to the extent of Newcastle but there were still opportunities to offload Brady and Klose which could have reportedly given us £20+ million plus the prem-level wages to alter the squad accordingly.[/quote]The difference still adds up to the fact that the major surgery required will probably take this window, and the next, to achieve.

[Cantiaci Canary 610]

There would have been a MELT DOWN if we had sold Klose, Brady, Olsson AND Redmond in the summer!

It was a valid strategy to keep the Premier League squad together (as Burnley did) but it hasn''t worked because AN hasn''t learned how to reverse a severe poor turn in form yet and he hasn''t put a fire in their bellies to step up when the chips are down.

Sadly, a more experienced manager would have this squad sitting pretty in 1st or 2nd now in my opinion.

[morty 0]

[quote user="Cantiaci Canary"]There would have been a MELT DOWN if we had sold Klose, Brady, Olsson AND Redmond in the summer!

It was a valid strategy to keep the Premier League squad together (as Burnley did) but it hasn''t worked because AN hasn''t learned how to reverse a severe poor turn in form yet and he hasn''t put a fire in their bellies to step up when the chips are down.

Sadly, a more experienced manager would have this squad sitting pretty in 1st or 2nd now in my opinion.[/quote]I still think it says as much, if not more about the players, than it does the manager.

[Cantiaci Canary 610]

Yes, they should be performing far better than they have been regardless of other factors.

[king canary 8,750]

@Morty

It''s a balancing act though isn''t it? We sold Johnson and you''re right he probably wasn''t good enough to be starting every week in the Premier League. But we didn''t replace that leadership, drive and toughness with our signings.

This summer we lost part-time captain Gary O''Neil and never replaced him. So rather than address the obvious mental weakness we actually made it worse- unless I''ve missed something in the leadership skills of Michael McGovern?

[Jim Smith 2,608]

[quote user="morty"]Alex Neil really isn''t the worst manager we have ever had.[/quote]

In terms of his managerial ability and what he has managed to do with the resources he has had at his disposal at this moment in time he is right up there with some of the worst of them in my book.

[morty 0]

[quote user="king canary"]@Morty

It''s a balancing act though isn''t it? We sold Johnson and you''re right he probably wasn''t good enough to be starting every week in the Premier League. But we didn''t replace that leadership, drive and toughness with our signings.

This summer we lost part-time captain Gary O''Neil and never replaced him. So rather than address the obvious mental weakness we actually made it worse- unless I''ve missed something in the leadership skills of Michael McGovern?[/quote]Thats the crux of what I am getting at, its rare we can actually afford this type of player that we all crave, we can afford the Bradley Johnson for the Championship, but a Bradley Johnson for the Premiership? Out of our reach. Occasionally we get it right, for that see Grant Holt.And when we are in the Premiership we have to look at a totally different type of player than we do when in the Championship. The board would have been slaughtered if we had targeted players who are short on Premiership quality, but are grafters and can put a shift in.Jez, not long after he came here alluded to the fact that the squad is imbalanced, and needs surgery.

[king canary 8,750]

@Cantiaci

I agree there would have been a meltdown if they''d all gone.

This summer though we did spend £15m on 4 players and could have used some of that to address the leadership/mental issues in the team. Instead of £8m on an attacking midfielder we didn''t really need (and Alex Neil doesn''t seem to want to use) we could have bought an experienced leader to play next to Klose. Instead of Canos could we not have put that money towards an experienced defensive midfielder?

The whole spine of this team needed work and we wasted a bunch of money n luxury players we didn''t really need.

[morty 0]

[quote user="king canary"]@Cantiaci

I agree there would have been a meltdown if they''d all gone.

This summer though we did spend £15m on 4 players and could have used some of that to address the leadership/mental issues in the team. Instead of £8m on an attacking midfielder we didn''t really need (and Alex Neil doesn''t seem to want to use) we could have bought an experienced leader to play next to Klose. Instead of Canos could we not have put that money towards an experienced defensive midfielder?

The whole spine of this team needed work and we wasted a bunch of money n luxury players we didn''t really need.[/quote]Point being though is that we didn''t know the mental toughness issue, until the wheels fell off. I am pretty sure the players all made the right noises in how much they were up for the fight, in the summer.

[Jim Smith 2,608]

[quote user="morty"][quote user="Cantiaci Canary"]There would have been a MELT DOWN if we had sold Klose, Brady, Olsson AND Redmond in the summer!

It was a valid strategy to keep the Premier League squad together (as Burnley did) but it hasn''t worked because AN hasn''t learned how to reverse a severe poor turn in form yet and he hasn''t put a fire in their bellies to step up when the chips are down.

Sadly, a more experienced manager would have this squad sitting pretty in 1st or 2nd now in my opinion.[/quote]I still think it says as much, if not more about the players, than it does the manager.[/quote]

Its about both but we''ve all been around long enough to have seen numerous examples where the same players perform markedly better immediately under a new manager. We saw exactly that with many of this lot two years ago when Neil came in. The fact that some of the players are culpable for how we have performed this season does not necessarily equate with the solution being ditching all the players in order to allow a manager who has show zero talent, ability or sound judgment now for 18 months to rebuild the squad. A large number of our players are good, international quality players (although the numbers are diminishing if Olsson is allowed to leave) who perform well for their countries yet appear unable to do even the most basic defensive tasks when playing for us in the league. I think to remove too much quality from the squad now and "start again" would be a huge mistake.