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hogesar

Match report whilst fresh in mind!

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Firstly for those who went, how easy was the car journey today? Just over 2 and a half hours and pretty smooth sailing bar one diversion.

Anyway, team announced and a little disappointed. Not the end of the world and probably against most other fans desires but I wanted Whittaker at RB with Martin replacing Bennett at CB. Bassong had a good second half at QPR so deserved to keep his place. The main thing to take from the team lineup was the guarantee we were sticking with 4-2-3-1, with Mulumbu obviously fit enough to start. When that was in doubt before the announcement I was hoping that would force a change in formation as Tettey would have been our only defensive midfielder which could have lent itself to the 4-4-2 diamond but never mind.

The key thing to probably take though from the opening minutes is formation is far less important than approach and mentality. We seemed to want it a bit more than Derby and soon our pressing was paying off. Derby were misplacing passes and when Bradley Johnson, mine and others former hero, first pass went straight to Naismith I started to think AN had got it right about BJ and maybe it was time for me to move on.

Despite being the better team we never really created much and I felt with us having the better possession particularly in offensive parts of the pitch , not getting a goal in this period was going to make it difficult. Hoolahan had given the ball away in unnecessary positions and Jacob was struggling to have an impact. Our only real decent chance was a penalty appeal where it looked like Jerome may have been fouled. But getting a 50/50 decision against Simon Hooper in our favour was never likely.

Second half and the main surprise was to see Lafferty coming on from Jerome. Not looked but I''ve presumed Jerome couldn''t continue. The obvious point raised around me was Alex adamant he had better options than Lafferty. Maybe he shouldn''t have used the plural for option as it appears the only striker he rates better than Lafferty is Jerome, even after Oliveira done an ok job against QPR by all accounts.

Anyway, second half we didn''t have the same intensity and Derby upped their game. When Bradley netted from outside the area I couldn''t help but feel a few different emotions.

1) Anger at our midfield. Where the fuck were Tettey and Mulumbu??

2) Some sympathy for our defence. Thought we''d defended ok albeit with limited pressure and felt they were left exposed by our midfield.

3) Nostalgia. Bradley ain''t the best technical player you''ll ever see but when he hits a ball it stays hit. And as the defensive ball winner and playmaker for Derby today he done a pretty good job. Not embarrassed to say I miss him and id probably swap Brady for him tomorrow.

4) Anger again. The above shows how much I like Bradley but as Norwich fans you don''t celebrate and sing the name of someone who scored against you.

The rest of the game we struggled to make much happen. Laffertys limitations as a striker were becoming clearer by the second and it wasn''t long before he picked up his obligatory yellow card.

A couple of free kicks but I can''t help but feel that when we''re chasing a game we never show the same urgency of other teams when the roles are reversed.

Not a bad enough performance to suggest the players aren''t playing for AN but this squad should never ever be losing 5 games in a row in this league. We only conceded one today but we didn''t look particularly dangerous up front. Still not sure what our game plan is when we go behind. Do exactly the same and hope?

Positive for today? I''ll go for Naismith. Thought he played ok and tried to organise those around him.

If we lose to Brentford, AN has to go. We''re fighting for a play off place and we''re currently 7th or 8th? Not good enough.

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Only thing I will add to that is that we can put this Lafferty nonsense to bed now.He was absolute turd when he came on.

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Agree Morty. For a tall big guy doesn''t hold up the ball well.

It''s concerned me even more about AN though, how the hell did he get a look in ahead of Oliveira??

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[quote user="hogesar"]Agree Morty. For a tall big guy doesn''t hold up the ball well.

It''s concerned me even more about AN though, how the hell did he get a look in ahead of Oliveira??[/quote]No idea. I thought Oliveira did okay last week.I guess Alex said to Laffs" Right you''re getting 45 minutes to stake your claim, go show me what you can do".Its patently obvious that Jerome is the only one of our strikers who can play the lone role though.

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It seemed watching on the wireless that the most incisive thing Lafferty did was get booked, as is the norm. Agreed, can we put the saviour bit to bed now, he''s not good enough and never will be!

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Good stuff lads.

Neil won''t win until he does win. Lafferty''s the answer when he doesn''t play but is not the answer when he does. I think today showed the players are playing for the manager. But it sounded like confidence was shot.

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[quote user="nutty nigel"]Good stuff lads.

Neil won''t win until he does win. Lafferty''s the answer when he doesn''t play but is not the answer when he does. I think today showed the players are playing for the manager. But it sounded like confidence was shot.[/quote]Definitely.

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[quote user="RUDOLPH HUCKER"]So, the manager and a number of players get umpteen chances but Lafferty is written off after getting 45 minutes he couldn''t have expected.[/quote]What did you think of his performance, how did he look to you?

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Except for Naismith''s shot we created next to nothing yet again. Still ponderous on the ball but slightly stronger with Mullumbu in midfield. I suppose we''re meant to clap at this point, hooray for the board and manager, we''re going to some new grounds in league one. You couldn''t make it up.

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[quote user="Highland Canary"]Except for Naismith''s shot we created next to nothing yet again. Still ponderous on the ball but slightly stronger with Mullumbu in midfield. I suppose we''re meant to clap at this point, hooray for the board and manager, we''re going to some new grounds in league one. You couldn''t make it up.[/quote]Seeing as you and a few others here have been whingeing since about two games after Wembley, surely you must have got used to the idea, by now?

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As I predicted on another thread, Morty and Nutty turn up with the ''players still playing for him'' guff. Guess it''s all they have left to defend the manager. But ultimately it is completely irrelevant now. All that matters is whether the manager is getting the best out of the players. Whether he is coaching them right. Whether he is setting them up right. Whether he is getting them psychologically right. And the answer to all of those questions is no, no he most certainly isn''t. But it''s OK cos apparently ''they are still playing for him''. Hell if we lose to Brentford Saturday it won''t matter along as ''they are still playing for him''. In fact I guess even if we lose 10 on the bounce it doesn''t matter along as ''they are still playing for him''........

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[quote user="Keith Scott"]As I predicted on another thread, Morty and Nutty turn up with the ''players still playing for him'' guff. Guess it''s all they have left to defend the manager. But ultimately it is completely irrelevant now. All that matters is whether the manager is getting the best out of the players. Whether he is coaching them right. Whether he is setting them up right. Whether he is getting them psychologically right. And the answer to all of those questions is no, no he most certainly isn''t. But it''s OK cos apparently ''they are still playing for him''. Hell if we lose to Brentford Saturday it won''t matter along as ''they are still playing for him''. In fact I guess even if we lose 10 on the bounce it doesn''t matter along as ''they are still playing for him''........[/quote]Did you go to the match today at all? Or did it just sound like they had given up, on the radio?Its patently obvious when players give up on their manager, and as much as you may not like it, ours haven''t.

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Dear oh dear. Do you get paid to completely miss the point? Anyway I''ll put the word in bold this time so it might sink in. Once again, whether ''the players are playing for him'' or not, is...... Ready...... IRRELEVANT. Capiche??

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[quote user="Keith Scott"]Dear oh dear. Do you get paid to completely miss the point? Anyway I''ll put the word in bold this time so it might sink in. Once again, whether ''the players are playing for him'' or not, is...... Ready...... IRRELEVANT. Capiche??[/quote]Were you at the game today then?

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Morty,

Not given up on the manager, or not given up on their their rofessional pride? There is a difference!

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Nope. Is that relevant? Does my being in attendance affect the fact that the manager is failing miserably. Does it affect the fact he isn''t getting the best out of the players in any way shape or form. Does it affect the fact we have now lost 6 on the bounce which is completely inexcusable and indefensible? Nope. It doesn''t. It''s as irrelevant as whether ''the players are still playing for him''.

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[quote user="Keith Scott"]Nope. Is that relevant? Does my being in attendance affect the fact that the manager is failing miserably. Does it affect the fact he isn''t getting the best out of the players in any way shape or form. Does it affect the fact we have now lost 6 on the bounce which is completely inexcusable and indefensible? Nope. It doesn''t. It''s as irrelevant as whether ''the players are still playing for him''.[/quote]Didn''t think so....

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Morty ,

I was at the game and the lack of response after the goal was apalling , Russell Martin should hang his head in shame no leadership no clue on the pitch.

Lafferty does not play well as lone striker never has done never will, thats not why he has scored hatful fo NI . He needs good crosses and play into box which rarely happened today.

The game was there for the taking if only we had taken a few more risks and half decent ref.

Jeremome got a hand smacked in face penalty any day of week and just as going for decent cross. Murphy chopped down when flying into box overheard a Derby fan saying dont know how got away with that one!

AN has aformation refuses to change hence Hools swapped for Pritchard when Murphy having terrible match and Hools creating only real chances.

This team have no drive no passion and somehow AN can not see that.

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[quote user="CJ"]Morty ,

I was at the game and the lack of response after the goal was apalling , Russell Martin should hang his head in shame no leadership no clue on the pitch.

Lafferty does not play well as lone striker never has done never will, thats not why he has scored hatful fo NI . He needs good crosses and play into box which rarely happened today.

The game was there for the taking if only we had taken a few more risks and half decent ref.

Jeremome got a hand smacked in face penalty any day of week and just as going for decent cross. Murphy chopped down when flying into box overheard a Derby fan saying dont know how got away with that one!

AN has aformation refuses to change hence Hools swapped for Pritchard when Murphy having terrible match and Hools creating only real chances.

This team have no drive no passion and somehow AN can not see that.[/quote]Points I agree on :-Yes, we need a better captain than RM.Yes, it was a definite penalty.Yes, so was Murphy''s.We really have no control over the ref.Points I don''t agree on :-Lafferty was bobbins today. Again.I don''t see the swap of Pritchard for Hoolahan as a problem, like for like, and fresh legs?We were good first half, but as pretty and pressing as it was, we never really troubled their keeper. We looked immediately worse in the second half when Jerome went off injured. I reckon, on the balance of it, we maybe, just about deserved a point, mainly because of a few terrible refereeing decisions.Overall, as I have already stated, the time for a manager to go is when he has lost the dressing room, and its obvious the players are no longer playing for him, that is not the case yet, in my opinion. But the run of results is getting too long to ignore now. The players, as the game wore on, looked like the confidence drained out of them, which you would expect from any group of players on a bad run.

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I''ll also add that I thought Mulumbu had a tidy game, considering how long it is since he was last in the first team.

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"I don''t see the swap of Pritchard for Hoolahan as a problem, like for like, and fresh legs?"

Is this not a problem though? Like for like is not changing anything to combat the oppositions tactics.

Where is Alex Neils plan B?

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[quote user="lharman7"]"I don''t see the swap of Pritchard for Hoolahan as a problem, like for like, and fresh legs?"

Is this not a problem though? Like for like is not changing anything to combat the oppositions tactics.

Where is Alex Neils plan B?[/quote]Depends if the problem was that Wes was tired really.Right, I''m not pretending nothings wrong, but we had two good penalty shouts turned down, and we were beaten by a solitary deflected goal.We limited a normally attacking Derby team to one long range punt from outside the box, I think JR made one other save, and that was about it.And we are playing the formation that best suits the players we have available.

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Didn''t go or hear the game today Morty, did you think the players are still playing for the manager?

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I understand with Wes'' age he will need replacing but surely that would be a great reason to change our tactical stance and go for it? We needed a goal (preferably two) and we kept tactically doing the same thing which has been failing us.

I disagree that we are playing the formation that best suits our players.

Yes it''s a little dated but we could have changed to a 4-4-2 or even 4-3-3.

I believe we have more than capable players to do this.

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[quote user="lharman7"]I understand with Wes'' age he will need replacing but surely that would be a great reason to change our tactical stance and go for it? We needed a goal (preferably two) and we kept tactically doing the same thing which has been failing us.

I disagree that we are playing the formation that best suits our players.

Yes it''s a little dated but we could have changed to a 4-4-2 or even 4-3-3.

I believe we have more than capable players to do this.[/quote]I believe, right now, we don''t.

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Would be interested in thoughts of anyone that went to the game if they thought the players were still " playing for the manager"

If they are then at least there is still some glimmer of hope.

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[quote user="Highland Canary"]Except for Naismith''s shot we created next to nothing yet again. Still ponderous on the ball but slightly stronger with Mullumbu in midfield. I suppose we''re meant to clap at this point, hooray for the board and manager, we''re going to some new grounds in league one. You couldn''t make it up.[/quote]

Actually YOU could, and doas you have regularly demonstrated on here

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Morty is "whether the players are still playing for the manager" now your sole criteria for whether a manager should stay in place?

As opposed to say, whether the manager is performing well or any good?

Also interested in your theory as to why we are almost always so much worse in the second half and whether that second half performance, immediately after a team talk, suggests they are really busting a gut for the manager? I felt at QPR you couldnt say the players were not trying but there is a difference between putting in a basic level of effort as professionals and really putting in a shift.

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