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lake district canary

Steady on!

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Lost badly away at Birmingham, gifting goals.............then went on a five match unbeaten run taking us to the top of the table.  Same can happen again - the players'' pride must kick in - especially as the next game is at CR. The manager can only do so much and it is up to the players. I don''t go along with this players get the manager sacked stuff....or that the crowd somehow decides when the manager goes by "turning" - it is down to the board to show some balls and this time stick with the manager through the bad times and see it through to at least January when we can ship out one or two and  bring in a defender or two.  So steady on - football is an up and down world and a lot can happen in a week.  Show a reaction against Leeds and get back to winning ways and things will look a lot better.

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Could not disagree more. The only way the board will show balls is by removing a clearly out of his depth manager from his post swiftly before it''s too late and it condemns us to a decade or more in this division.

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[quote user="Jim Smith"]Could not disagree more. The only way the board will show balls is by removing a clearly out of his depth manager from his post swiftly before it''s too late and it condemns us to a decade or more in this division.[/quote]

I can understand the anger and the frustration, but change doesn''t necessarily mean we will improve. We will still have the same players - and they are the ones that are letting us down.  If AN goes, chances are Irvine would be asked to take over, so the change wouldn''t be massive - and AN is still the manager who knows how to galvanise a team and get them promoted - he''s done it before and can do it again. 

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I watched the game yesterday almost in disbelief that these players were in the Premiership last season-no ideas, no movement, very little effort apart from a couple of players. The manager may have lost the dressing room but the players really need to have a long look at themselves as I''m not sure that some of them deserve to be wearing the yellow and green.

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lake district canary wrote the following post at 2016-10-30 11:26 AM:

Lost badly away at Birmingham, gifting goals.............then went on a five match unbeaten run taking us to the top of the table. Same can happen again - the players'' pride must kick in - especially as the next game is at CR. The manager can only do so much and it is up to the players.

I don''t go along with this players get the manager sacked stuff....or that the crowd somehow decides when the manager goes by "turning" - it is down to the board to show some balls and this time stick with the manager through the bad times and see it through to at least January when we can ship out one or two and bring in a defender or two.

So steady on - football is an up and down world and a lot can happen in a week. Show a reaction against Leeds and get back to winning ways and things will look a lot better.

Yes agree LDC, players pride should kick in, but those same players have to 1) Trust their colleagues, especially the Captain. 2) Want to play and also trust their manager!

The two above mentioned contrived this week to take an internal matter into hand, and the result of that decision yesterday was the catalyst for this thrashing. All is not well, did you/have you listened to the after match interviews of Martin - was it coincidental the club put him forward as the player for this media interview - and the manager, who admitted himself that certain players ''gave up''. Are they the same players Martin refers too? Make up your own mind, but my take is that between them the manager, and captain, have lost the dressing room!

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Yes he got he promoted with a squad that wasn''t his.

But he then got us relegated and has pretty much been going backwards as a manager since last October

If you want to ignore everything that has happened since then thats up to you.

Do we really want to chance it that another new manager could come in in February and get the squad playing & promoted?

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Morty''s right. Leeds is a crucial game, not so much in the result, but the attitude of the team.

Off the pitch AN can spend all week training, talking tactics, galvanising, encouraging and give pep talks prior to game, but once those 11 players are out their, as professionals, it''s up to them to perform on the pitch.

Would like to think that AN will act and drop those playing a shocker yesterday, but if we see another non performance, that will indicate these players don''t want to play for AN

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As has been said the Leeds game is a vital one for AN. When the captain states that some players weren''t trying and some gave up you know there are real problems in the dressing room. If the team loses against Leeds and do so with a bad display then it is difficult to see how AN can continue. Let''s hope yesterday was an aberration and we can get back on track.

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[quote user="......and Smith must score."][quote user="Herman"][quote user="morty"]Good man.[/quote]He stumbled into Kemptown. He had a GOOOOD night[:D][/quote]

I woke up in Kemptown this morning.

I''m told I had a good night too.....[/quote][:D]

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I think it is a situation that we as fans have seen for a number of years.

Our squad has a number who have been here during relegation so and promotions, none of those players have dramatically seen their stock rise other than at Carrow road. Would I say they have improved as players, I would say hoolahan has but not Martin, not ruddy after his injury, not Bennett etc.

We relied on hoolahan for creativity luckily Pritchard and a few players have been brought in and hopefully over time we are less reliant on hoolahan. But for an opposing manager it has been the same tactics to nullify Norwich which is stop hoolahan.

AN came in with a group that rightly got back in the promotion mood and of course transfer windows were poorly managed when we critically needed to upgrade on players mentioned above.

During this time performances were very reminiscent of this season, a number of games where we never turned up, villa away last year, Birmingham and Preston this year. Games were results were disastrous Newcastle away and Liverpool at home, I will come back to this, and ones where we let results slip Fulham and Newcastle this season.

Now the disastrous games that were mentioned changed our mentality, after Newcastle away we visibly changed our outlook and said it publicly. I listened to an interview with Eddie Howe last year where he said he did not do that when there were doubters, he installed all the things that make Bournemouth successful and we all know what happened to them. Yes it may be in the support term, but an interesting piece.

AN has his limitations and we are seeing poor selection choices, mismanagement of games etc, which does not bode well for a team that is a likely automatic promotion favourite. He has not been helped by the board and I believe not by players.

We have a group who have not shown up for the run in under Houghton, he games with Adams and for some of last season with AN. There clearly is a situation going through the group and all has not been well for a while.

I do believe that if the performance is poor against Leeds it could be a turning point but if the performance is bad and we get three points are we waiting to see over the next few games, or is the situation likely to arise as we have players who are disgruntled or actually showing their level?

An interesting few days in the media and at Colney.

Yes I agree the fans should get behind the players and team at the next game, absolutely, but does it mask a situation that is much deeper and detrimental to our only goal promotion.

It is exactly like the grabban situation last season, why we did not get rid of him I do not know. We had a player who wanted out here, disgruntled and a problem. In the end we were lucky Bournemouth came back for him in January. I would say Brady is not as open about it, but pretty sure he would be happy to move in January. will Martin Olsson has been here through some tough times and probably is aware that AN could still be the manager next year and NCFC could be a team that misses promotion and dismantled or a team that goes up but he will fight another relegation battle. He is being wise just holding back. But it speaks volumes about where the club is.

I have seen enough self destructs at NCFC to say this is no different to others, but it is the way this has arrived. Wins masking inadequate team and individual performances, no changes when a sub came on and now '' no shows'' or the inability of finishing of a game and losing valuable points.

So much going on and somehow still a good run can get us back on top. Time for AN to show some of the strength he has.

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We are missing Howson very much, his value being apparent in his absence. This is the midfield hole we need to fill if we are going to fix the system. Pinto should be back at least.

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[quote user="lake district canary"][quote user="Jim Smith"]Could not disagree more. The only way the board will show balls is by removing a clearly out of his depth manager from his post swiftly before it''s too late and it condemns us to a decade or more in this division.[/quote]

I can understand the anger and the frustration, but change doesn''t necessarily mean we will improve. We will still have the same players - and they are the ones that are letting us down.  If AN goes, chances are Irvine would be asked to take over, so the change wouldn''t be massive - and AN is still the manager who knows how to galvanise a team and get them promoted - he''s done it before and can do it again. 

[/quote]

I fear you have too much faith in the managers ability.

The difference between now and 2 yrs ago when AN took over is the quality of the squad.....

2 yrs ago he came in and re invigorated a struggling championship side, players that in all honesty were playing around their true level, Whittaker, Bassong, Turner, Martin, Josh, Grabham, Johnstone. Hooper, Elliot Bennett, Gary O''neill....

He convinced these players they could make the step up and built a unity within them !

This year (and we are indeed a victim of our own success in the transfer market here) he has to convince players of the calibre of Klose, Naismith, Pritcard, Olyviera, Olsson, Brady etc etc that they need to put in the effort and a shift fighting for every ball scrapping for every point to get back to the big time....

Well are you convinced ? No me neither should he manage to work the oracle and get us promoted do any of this lot believe they will win/challenge for honours wearing the yellow shirt of the Canaries ?

My point being 2 yrs ago it was easy to man manager lesser able''d players and get them fighting to achieve a better level

This term he has to many big ego''s who have done it at higher levels to be motivated by a guy who has won/achieved sweet FA in his career !

I guess the threat of being dropped would have Timmy wetting his pants....and even should that happen would it make him want to play harder next week ? or would it further strengthen his resolve that the little bald scot knows FA ?

Has being dropped galvanised Naismith....Brady ?

This is the most expensive/gifted squad Norwich city have ever assembled.....but with that comes a host of other issues not forseen by many/most

The job is now simply to big for AN !

To many players have no faith in his ability or tactics.

Look at what happened to Jose Mourinho last season.

It takes a big character to man manage bog ego''s !

Newcastle have the benefit of Rafa......

Its time to change it before its too late to salvage some sort of unity in the dressing room !

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[quote user="lake district canary"]So steady on.........[/quote][8].......now''s your chance,[8]Oh doh, they''ve scored five goals. [:''(] [:''(] [:''(]

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[quote user="lake district canary"]I don''t go along with this players get the manager sacked stuff....or that the crowd somehow decides when the manager goes by "turning" -

[/quote]Plain that you don''t get to CR much, LDC.The Boards determination to hang on to a manager can only be stretched so far in the face of crowd unrest. I''ve seen it enough times to be confident in that statement.No manager can buck poor results for ever. There eventually comes a point where they step off the cliff edge and there''s no way back.

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[quote user="ricardo"][quote user="lake district canary"]I don''t go along with this players get the manager sacked stuff....or that the crowd somehow decides when the manager goes by "turning" -

[/quote]Plain that you don''t get to CR much, LDC.The Boards determination to hang on to a manager can only be stretched so far in the face of crowd unrest. I''ve seen it enough times to be confident in that statement.No manager can buck poor results for ever. There eventually comes a point where they step off the cliff edge and there''s no way back.[/quote]

I''ve been plenty of times over the years and was at the infamous 1-7, Ricardo, so I do know what it is like......but the board have to be stronger in the face of such turmoil.    Sacking Gunn was inevitable, sacking Hughton - imo - was not.  Even after the crowd revolted, with five games left, he should imo have been given the rest of the season.  They set their stall out in January, to give him the rest of the season - they should have stuck to that.   The fans are important, of course - but they do not run the club or necessarily know what is best.  The board may make themselves unpopular, but they are there to serve the best interests of the club - and letting fans dictate what happens, is not what should happen imo.  Hoding your nerve in the face of the severest circumstances is what is needed.  Imo, we should be nowhere near losing AN, crowd or no crowd.  He has time to turn it round and imo, will.

 

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Anybody who was at the West Brom game before Hughton was sacked can tell you about the absolutely toxic atmosphere that day. He even got a clapper thrown at him. He''d lost most of the crowd and the atmosphere in future games would have been awful for him had he not been sacked. Sometimes you just have to be there yourself I suppose....

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[quote user="lake district canary"][quote user="ricardo"][quote user="lake district canary"]I don''t go along with this players get the manager sacked stuff....or that the crowd somehow decides when the manager goes by "turning" -

[/quote]Plain that you don''t get to CR much, LDC.The Boards determination to hang on to a manager can only be stretched so far in the face of crowd unrest. I''ve seen it enough times to be confident in that statement.No manager can buck poor results for ever. There eventually comes a point where they step off the cliff edge and there''s no way back.[/quote]

I''ve been plenty of times over the years and was at the infamous 1-7, Ricardo, so I do know what it is like......but the board have to be stronger in the face of such turmoil.    Sacking Gunn was inevitable, sacking Hughton - imo - was not.  Even after the crowd revolted, with five games left, he should imo have been given the rest of the season.  They set their stall out in January, to give him the rest of the season - they should have stuck to that.   The fans are important, of course - but they do not run the club or necessarily know what is best.  The board may make themselves unpopular, but they are there to serve the best interests of the club - and letting fans dictate what happens, is not what should happen imo.  Hoding your nerve in the face of the severest circumstances is what is needed.  Imo, we should be nowhere near losing AN, crowd or no crowd.  He has time to turn it round and imo, will.

  [/quote]I''m not taking sides here LDC. I don''t want to see AN sacked, I''m simply stating the obvious that they all have a limited life span and when you are sitting in crowd you know when that time has come to an end. My reading is that he is close to cliff edge but by no means over it yet.Hughton danced at the last chance saloon on more than one occasion and just did enough to justify his retention until the WBA game. Many argued that he should have gone before he did, but the groundswell never reached a critical point. We all knew what we''d seen when we walked out after that final whistle.

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