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Yorkshire  Canary

saturday will be a significant day

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Leeds are a dangerous side and monk is starting to get a tune out of them. History has shown that our board over the last 20 years ish only act when the crowd turn. Despite our very poor recent form and the well documented shortcomings and discontent with manager and players alike a win on Saturday will give the board the encouragement to put sticking plaster over the cracks and stay as you are. A list particularly a poor loss and the mild mannered crowd will I think turn and there will be no way back. It will be an interesting afternoon with ramifications Beyond 3 points

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It''s interesting to speculate Yorkshire. I do know that there was a lot of anger amongst the traveling faithful on Saturday, both toward the manager and the players, but as has been said elsewhere, for various reasons the manager is the one that will ultimately end up carrying the can.

If we play well on Saturday I still think there is sufficient good will toward the manager for things to be pulled back. My fear is that we will start well but will end up conceding goals again and if that happens and we lose from a winning position then IMO it will become very unpleasant.

Horrible situation to be in now where you almost have some fans waiting for things to go wrong so that they can have a go.

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Unfortunately I think you''re right Yorkshire. I have never booed the team in my life and I won''t this week even if there is a no show but you can be sure there will be plenty who will.

Your most telling point is that the board seldom act until the crowd turn. That frankly is unacceptable. We need more proactive leadership than that. Opportunities were missed last season when we were, as a premiership club, in a better position to attract a proven manager and again this season when Bruce was available.

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Sounds like he only has half a squad to pick from, some want him gone anyway.

If he gets a decent victory from those loyal to the club he has a chance. If he left, I think some of the players are going to blame those not trying- who will probably end up leaving in January anyway.

Either way, Jez is going to be busy over the coming months - shifting out the quitters and possibly finding a new manager.

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It will only be like Burnley at home if we make it so. There''s no need for protests, the score-line did enough... Just get behind the boys and hopefully we will come away with 3 points. If we don''t and he starts to lose the crowd, then we''ll see - but I''m confident it won''t come to that. There''s a lot to be proven by the manager and the team. Every single player will be under scrutiny to perform, nobody can come out of that shambles with their head held high. It was like Fulham all over again. But we can and will bounce back, and a win against Leeds would be the perfect tonic.

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[quote user="AJ"]It will only be like Burnley at home if we make it so. There''s no need for protests, the score-line did enough... Just get behind the boys and hopefully we will come away with 3 points. If we don''t and he starts to lose the crowd, then we''ll see - but I''m confident it won''t come to that. There''s a lot to be proven by the manager and the team. Every single player will be under scrutiny to perform, nobody can come out of that shambles with their head held high. It was like Fulham all over again. But we can and will bounce back, and a win against Leeds would be the perfect tonic.[/quote]We had a few games like this under Hughton ie limping on by winning a few must wins until the wheels eventually came off. By the time Neil gets sacked Paul Lambert will have been snapped up by another team.I really can''t understand why Neil is still in charge especially when so many fans and players want him out.

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While i don''t agree with the Lambert sentiment, I agree re limping on until it all completely fell to bits under Hughton. You cant get into a situation where you have a must win game a month without ever stringing together a run of results

On a side note, is there a good time to change manager?

If there is surely the November international break is the time to do it - a new manager can assess the squad & make change in January if needed. I''m sure that''s the point Wiz tried to make with the infamous ''Beating West Ham Could Relegate Us'' thread

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We aren''t limping though, we''re in contention for the league title as it stands. Totally different circumstances for me, although things clearly need addressing, hopefully we can make it to Jan doing what we''re doing then we need some decent defensive investment.

As for the obsession with Lambert, what did he do at Aston Villa or Blackburn that warrants him even being a candidate should we have a managerial vacancy? If we''re basing this on pasts glories, we may as well bring Huckerby, Drury, Ruel Fox, Goss, Keelan etc back and out of retirement as well...

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AJ your extreme happy clapping is doing the club you are supposed to support great harm

It''s not about the individual it''s about the club

Get him out and get behind this or hold your extremist views to yourself

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I agree that we need to get Neil out and get Lambert in as soon as possible. It''s as simple as that really. If we miss out on Lambert we will only have ourselves to blame.

So what if there was a "perfect storm" when he joined in 2009? The man gave us some unbelievable years and we played great football under him and I would prefer a real manager like him in charge instead of a pretender like AN.

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I''m not sure how you can see me as "extreme happy clapping" - I''m just being level headed. It''s hard to dissect your post because there''s an "extremist" lack of critical response. There''s no need to be rash. It''s one or two bad results yes, and yes we need to improve if we''re going to go up automatically. But, at the start of the season if you would have said after 15 games we''d be 4 points off top I''m sure nobody here would be disappointed with that. I''m sure sacking the management and destabilising the team even further with the possibility of players that AN persuaded to stay jumping ship come Jan will certainly help the club move forwards. But you know, it''s just my opinion after all, and if you don''t want to read it you don''t have to. At least, don''t come on to a public forum asking me to not make use of a public space to express the thoughts about the club I support as I freely wish and am entitled to. On the one hand there''s disagreeing and debating, on the other there''s pointless abuse. I''ll let you decide which side you stand on.

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[quote user="AJ"]We aren''t limping though, we''re in contention for the league title as it stands. .[/quote]Our current points total is probably overstated by 4 or 5 points.Therefore our league position is probably overstated by 5 or 6 placesWhen we were top we were fortunate, mostly against the weaker teams in this league, to get some of results that we did.Apart from Saturday I don''t think our form has dipped much lately but teams have now seen where are weaknesses are and it''s not difficult for them to get a result against us.Despite the deficiencies being obvious for most of our games, AN has done nothing to address the situation.Waiting for the January window won''t help either as most business is not done until the end of the month so that''s potentially another 14 games before players can be bought and bedded in.Carry on over those 14 games in the same fashion and we won''t be in contention for anything.So do you let him just carry on and hope that he can fix something that thus far he has been unable to fix or do you do something before it''s too late.As I said in another thread, it''s not about where you were or where you are, it''s about the direction you are travelling in.

 

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4th in the league and people want the manager sacked...

Hilariously if we bring a new manager in and finish 4th same moaners will accept it... if we finished 10th it would be because it was AN''s team....

If we finished 4th under A N we''d have under achieved....

Because thats how the average fan thinks...

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The Leeds game represents the proverbial see-saw; lose - especially from a winning position & we''ll see a flood of negativity & abuse. However a convincing win is likely to tip the balance towards a rise of spirit all round.

It''s delicately poised alright...

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Lambert back for me too , Villa did not go down while he was there and in the circumstances he probably did a very good job , Blackburn was clearly a mistake taking the job and he got out asap . Alex Neil has never been and never looked like becoming and never will be anywhere near the manager Lambert is . Its a straightforward easy decision Alex Neil is not good enough he does not even play his own signings , and for me anybody who thought you could go into the Championship season with just one average striker available does not deserve to be called a manager .

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Making plans, how can our points be "overstated"?

We have as many points as we have, the table doesn''t lie at any stage of the season! We are the fourth best team in the league at the time of posting this - that is a fact.

How that changes from this point on does indeed depend on improvements in a number of areas, yes, but we certainly haven''t limped in every game. Games like Fulham, Leeds in the cup, Cardiff and Wigan at home are certainly areas of great concern though, and obviously Brighton goes without saying. If we continue at our current rate and everyone else does too, the table says we''ll finish fourth - to say we won''t be in contention for anything isn''t true. To say we wouldn''t be in contention for automatic promotion however is probably true though and I certainly hope we do enough to address those issues quick so we do remain in contention.

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[quote user="AJ"]Making plans, how can our points be "overstated"? .[/quote]I''m talking about what we have versus what could so easily have been and probably, based on overall play in some of those games, should have been.As for tables not lieing, over the last 8 matches we are 8th in the current form table.We have got 13 points out of a possible 24 and let in 16 goals - you will not be in contention for anything averaging 1.6 points per game and letting in 2 goals a gameBrighton, Newcastle, Leeds, Bristol City, Reading, Preston and Sheff Weds are all above us.So "if we continue at the current rate, and everyone else does", we will not finish 4th, and we probably won''t finish as high as 6th either.

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As Saturday is Bonfire Night the question of whose effigy should sit on the burning stack arises. Should it be the traditional Guy or something more creative?

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Fascinating to see what team he selects. Those not selected I would suggest will be going in January - probably the result there lack of effort has been working towards.

Unless Alex isn''t with us then.

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