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Presser vs Cardiff

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Lake District Canary wrote:

''''If he started the new job at Norwich and respected the players around him he would be prepared to stick around and fight for his place and he wouldn''t be be looking to go elsewhere to get games after just a few weeks. ''''

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How exactly has he disrespected his team-mates?

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[quote user="Hank shoots Skyler"]Lake District Canary wrote:

''''If he started the new job at Norwich and respected the players around him he would be prepared to stick around and fight for his place and he wouldn''t be be looking to go elsewhere to get games after just a few weeks. ''''

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How exactly has he disrespected his team-mates?[/quote]You don''t come to a club and expect to be in front of anyone else, because if you do, you are disrespecting the other players by thinking you are better than them.  He''s not getting games and has asked to go on loan.  That may be showing a good attitude, or ot may be showing a bad attitude - I don''t know - but in the absence of any real information other that the loan has come as a result of his own volition - I would say that as a fan, I would have preferred him to stay and fight for his place rather than go elsewhere.  I would have thought we would have seen more of him and I don''t know why we haven''t.  That could be down to several things, but as a player with clear ability, you would have thought he would have had some minutes in the first team in the league. Temperament - or more likely maturity - are likely to be a reason why he hasn''t appeared more,  but he doesn''t imo need to go on loan - stay and fight for your place,  keep your head down and work and the chances will come.  As it is we have likely lost him for the season. Great. 

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So he has an attitude problem and has been disrespectful to his team mates too.

Jeez, real bad apple this one.

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"That may be showing a good attitude, or ot may be showing a bad attitude - I don''t know"

Indeed.

Players should want the thrust of competition, games that matter and the pressure to perform.

Now I don''t know either but if Naismith had agreed to go to Sunderland then I doubt Maddison would have gone.

The sense i get is that he is young and restless and wants to improve by playing proper matches. I think that is a credit to him and not a question on his temperament.

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I don''t think the other players see it like that at all. When Maddison came to the club Pritchard wasn''t here and he realistically would''ve had much more of a chance getting a first team spot before this signing.

Could it be that the reason we haven''t seen him at league-level is because he''s not quite ready yet?

I trust that if AN thought Maddison could contribute significantly to our season, he would''ve told him to stay. AN is the one who sees him train day-in day-out after all - I think basing his talent in games against poor opposition is not an accurate gauge.

That''s not to say he didn''t play well - but look at how Josh Murphy and Andreu have played in similar fixtures! The former of which has also looked way off the pace in every league game this season.

Where do you see Maddison fitting in with our first team plans given that Pritchard is now back up to speed? Two £8m players and Wes Hoolahan ahead of him!

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[quote user="Hank shoots Skyler"]

Where do you see Maddison fitting in with our first team plans given that Pritchard is now back up to speed? Two £8m players and Wes Hoolahan ahead of him![/quote]I see him on the periphary of the team, fighting to get on the bench, getting a few minutes here and there and taking his chance when he gets it. A player can get injured or go off form and that is when another player gets his chance. Pritchard, Naismith and Wes might all be vying for two places in the team - if Maddison was here,he would be the fourth one. Four players for two places seems sensible, two to play two to cover/compete.

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"That may be showing a good attitude, or ot may be showing a bad attitude - I don''t know"

Indeed.

Players should want the thrust of competition, games that matter and the pressure to perform.

Now I don''t know either but if Naismith had agreed to go to Sunderland then I doubt Maddison would have gone.

The sense i get is that he is young and restless and wants to improve by playing proper matches. I think that is a credit to him and not a question on his temperament.

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[quote user="Katie Borkins"]

The sense i get is that he is young and restless and wants to improve by playing proper matches.[/quote]

Then he made a mistake coming to Norwich.  I''m not out to villify the lad or anything, but if you come to a club like ours, you have to be prepared to fight for your place. He was getting game time in cup matches and if we had a good cup run that would be great for him and his career here, if he played well and lead to ore opprtunities in the league. It seems odd to me to make a big move to a club then ask to go out on loan after only a few weeks because you''re not getting games....

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Not sure why you think there''s two positions available Lakey? There''s only one IMO.

I suppose that Pritchard and Hoolahan could potentially play either side of the CAM which would make the competition less fierce for Maddison with only Naismith remaining. But then you have more of a dilemma between Brady, Canos, Jarvis and the Murphy''s... We are certainly well equipped for attacking midfielders!

As I said, if AN saw him breaking into the side or playing a significant amount for us in the league then I''m sure he would''ve stayed. I don''t get why you think him moving to Aberdeen is somehow the easy option though - moving to Scotland at the age of 19..?! F**k that.

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[quote user="lake district canary"][quote user="Katie Borkins"]

The sense i get is that he is young and restless and wants to improve by playing proper matches.[/quote]

Then he made a mistake coming to Norwich.  I''m not out to villify the lad or anything, but if you come to a club like ours, you have to be prepared to fight for your place. He was getting game time in cup matches and if we had a good cup run that would be great for him and his career here, if he played well and lead to ore opprtunities in the league. It seems odd to me to make a big move to a club then ask to go out on loan after only a few weeks because you''re not getting games....

[/quote]Other than brand him as having a bad attitude, and being disrespectful to his team mates?

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I do sense that this is a wholly manufactured agenda for reasons best known to yourself, LDC. Your ability to defend your obvious inconsistency regarding our players astounds me.

Ricky dserved a chance despite having had more lives than a cat. Wilbraham was a hero. Snoddy was only out for himself. Naismith may come good (he may, to be fair). And now Maddison wants to play regular competitive football so he has an attitude problem.

M''kay... 😡

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[quote user="Katie Borkins"]I do sense that this is a wholly manufactured agenda for reasons best known to yourself, LDC. Your ability to defend your obvious inconsistency regarding our players astounds me.

Ricky dserved a chance despite having had more lives than a cat. Wilbraham was a hero. Snoddy was only out for himself. Naismith may come good (he may, to be fair). And now Maddison wants to play regular competitive football so he has an attitude problem.

M''kay... 😡[/quote]

As you well know, I speak as I find.  To me the Maddison signing had already taken a slightly unusual state, with every time he plays, by all accounts he is excellent and yet can''t get a look in the league.  Age should not be a barrier and if you are good enough, age is immaterial. Rooney was a first teamer by the age of 16.  There is imo far to much molly coddlng of young players, so what if he is 19 - if he is good enough - get him in there involved in the match days, on the bench and getting some game time as a sub and let him make the breakthrough.  He obviously felt he wasn''t going to get a look in as a first team squad regular.....so why did we spend £3m plus to buy him - a lot of money to spend just to loan a player out. 

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LDC wrote:

''''every time he plays, by all accounts he is excellent and yet can''t get a look in the league. ''''

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By every time he plays, you mean 2 competitive matches - a cup game against Coventry and an Under-23 match against Peterborough, is that right?

ANDREU SCORED A HAT-TRICK IN ONE OF THESE GAMES

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"Speak as I find" = I make assumptions about people''s character based on my perception of how professional football works, although I am not and have never been a professional footballer.

Magic.

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[quote user="Katie Borkins"]"Speak as I find" = I make assumptions about people''s character based on my perception of how professional football works, although I am not and have never been a professional footballer.

Magic.[/quote]

I may not know much about football, but footballers are human like the rest of us.  Of course he wants to succeed and play more, but there are two things you can do in his situation. Stay and keep your head down and work with the class players around you, to learn off them and develop your game with them, or go out to a lower level and play with lower standard players. I know which I would prefer him to do.  Players going out on short term loan is fine if the club have decided it is the right thing - but AN had said he had no plans to send Maddison out on loan and we are told this was instigated by the player.  So be it.  You could say it shows strong character to do that, or you could say it shows weakness in not sticking it out and fighting for your place. To me, he should be staying and fighting for his place. 

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[quote user="lake district canary"][quote user="Katie Borkins"]"Speak as I find" = I make assumptions about people''s character based on my perception of how professional football works, although I am not and have never been a professional footballer.

Magic.[/quote]

I may not know much about football, but footballers are human like the rest of us.  Of course he wants to succeed and play more, but there are two things you can do in his situation. Stay and keep your head down and work with the class players around you, to learn off them and develop your game with them, or go out to a lower level and play with lower standard players. I know which I would prefer him to do.  Players going out on short term loan is fine if the club have decided it is the right thing - but AN had said he had no plans to send Maddison out on loan and we are told this was instigated by the player.  So be it.  You could say it shows strong character to do that, or you could say it shows weakness in not sticking it out and fighting for your place. To me, he should be staying and fighting for his place. 

[/quote]See, you can talk sense when you want to.....

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Jeez, the loan is only until January, not until the end of time. It''s basically three months in which he gets to play competitive matches and then comes back to us.

By which time a certain Mr. Naismith may be shipping out and freeing up a first team place or one of the youngsters to grab.

In any event, Maddison comes back more experienced and match fit. Win/win for everybody

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[quote user="Rock The Boat"]Jeez, the loan is only until January, not until the end of time. It''s basically three months in which he gets to play competitive matches and then comes back to us.

By which time a certain Mr. Naismith may be shipping out and freeing up a first team place or one of the youngsters to grab.

In any event, Maddison comes back more experienced and match fit. Win/win for everybody[/quote]Ok. Fair enough, but I would still prefer him to have stayed and developed within the squad, get to know players more, better understanding of the club and the way the manager wants us to play, etc, etc.   He''s only been here a couple of months.

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The loan is only until January?!

That''s 2017, it''s like a whole year away!

Clubs in crisis!

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[quote user="lake district canary"][quote user="Rock The Boat"]Jeez, the loan is only until January, not until the end of time. It''s basically three months in which he gets to play competitive matches and then comes back to us.

By which time a certain Mr. Naismith may be shipping out and freeing up a first team place or one of the youngsters to grab.

In any event, Maddison comes back more experienced and match fit. Win/win for everybody[/quote]Ok. Fair enough, but I would still prefer him to have stayed and developed within the squad, get to know players more, better understanding of the club and the way the manager wants us to play, etc, etc.   He''s only been here a couple of months.

[/quote]If Maddison isn''t getting into AN''s preferred 4-2-3-1, he sure as hell isn''t going to get in any other formation unless we one week had three or four midfielders crocked - and that little fact my fellow NCFC supporter, rendered this whole thread completely superfluous from the off [:|]What''s the story behind the hat?

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