Murphys and Morris

[ABC (A Basingstoke Canary) 26]

Any thoughts on whether this trio should be included as part of our attacking line-up?

The twins are 21 and CM is 21 in December - with the amount of 1st team football they''ve experienced elsewhere, surely they are good enough to brought into the squad?

The danger of not bringing them in is twofold:

1) They could become disillusioned and ...

2) It would disincentivise anyone from joining our academy (who was the last academy player to regularly feature with the 1st team?)

As for the Madisons, McGrandles and Thompsons of the world ...... I suspect their opportunities will be even more remote if the above trio are left on the sidelines

[Bethnal Yellow and Green 1,557]

Josh proved he is good enough for the Champ last season - so expect him to provide some cover on the wings, or even as a striker as he often played there for MK.

Jacob had a mixed time at Coventry, many fans didn''t really rate him whilst many fans thought he was excellent. Think he might need to go on loan again (or be sold if a good bid comes in).

Carlton Morris was average in Scotland it appears. Don''t think he is going to be troubling Carrow Road anytime soon.

I think McGrandles and Thompson will be sold soon. Out of all the younger players you''ve mentioned I wouldn''t be surprised if Maddison plays the most.

[Salopian 1]

Both Murphy boys have shown pace, passing and shooting ability, and I have no doubt that they could "cut it" at Championship level, especially if we sell both Redmond and Brady.

McGrandles was something of a prodigy in Scotland, playing in senior teams while only 17 or 18. He never really threatened to get into the first team at CR, but then we have a huge number of central midfielders. Lately, of course he had the serious injury.

Thompson seemed very promising, but of late doesn''t seem to have set the world alight.

Now we are reportedly chasing a Reading midfielder, and we have signed yet other "prospects". We already have Howson, probably at his peak, Dorrans, Tettey and Mulumbu. The midfield arguably doesn''t need any more.

We are short of good strikers. Whether Morris is good enough for next season, I have no idea. He did score a few vital goals for Hamilton, and he should return to us with more experience. Otherwise the strike force is pretty bare after Naismith and Jerome.

I shall not be confident until we reinforce the spine of the team, and would like to see at least a couple of strikers, one good central defender signed even if Timm continues with us., and possibly a couple of full backs. I am not optimistic.

[Yellowbeagle 0]

I think josh is most likely to threaten the irst 11. I think Jacobs path will be blocked by his brother and i think Morris will need to drop a level to have a chance at comming back up sometime in his career.

[BroadstairsR 2,137]

I think that "It''s Now or Never" for the brothers and for Morris.

Or is it "O Sole Mio." in this respect.

[sgncfc 1,221]

I expect Josh and Jacob Murphy to be the joint replacements for Redmond and I would also think Maddison will feature for the first team - all dependent on a decent pre-season.

Wouldn''t surprise me to see Joe Crowe and Todd Cantwell in the first team squad too. Both are fine prospects and should at least get on the bench next year.

As for the rest, I doubt any of them will get close this year. Morris possibly, but as we know it''s a long way from Hamilton Accies to the Championship.

[Lynn Canary 0]

I''d expect Toffolo to be understudy to Olsson this season. I''d also expect to see both Murphys featuring along with Morris. Yes Morris didn''t get bags full of goals but he was never going to in a team who''s main objective every season is to stay up. He definately has the physique for the Championship. Maddison I would imagine will challenge Wes for his position, which I would imagine will block Cantwell''s path. And maybe thompson might feature aswell. I''d be surprised if we saw any other players apart from them. I''d like to see efete maybe get a chance in the cup, and maybe Middleton aswell. He will be very raw but seems like a major prospect

[Horse Renoir 1]

I don''t think we''re trying to sign future superstars and any that grew up in our academy would have been poached a while ago. The goal for all these lads is to become comfortable PL players, that happens to most players at around age 25-27 with most sporadically breaking into FL teams at around 22-23, so they''re still very young.

If we were aiming for less than promotion I could see a few breaking in, but I don''t think many of our younger players will trouble the first team for a couple more years yet. The likes of Shaw, Barkley, Rashford etc may be playing PL level at a very young age but they''re future regular internations, the goal for our lot is to become good enough to help just establish us at PL level or maybe command a 5m+ fee. We aren''t looking for really young players who could shine in our first team now because young players of this quality would be unlikely to join us or stay for a long time

[If wed only kept Howie.. 3]

Championship is a long haul - therefore we need a big squad - and i''d expect them all to be part of that squad...

Regular starters? maybe not - but as Loza showed season before last, even a single brief appearance can make a vital difference

[pete 318]

Get real there ain''t gonna be much money spent vibes coming out of club not good any half decent squad member will play. Josh and Jacob will be in squad as back up to Jarvis and whoever plays on the right. Carlton will be fourth choice striking option I certainly hope he''s not second or third. Toffolo back up to Olsson if he is still here. Maddison will be expecting to feature. Others probably not.

[AJ 1,218]

I certainly think Josh will be in or around the first team, Jacob may well be considered on the fringes too. Pre-Season could be make or break for them.

As for Morris, I cannot see him breaking into the first team when we''re only playing one up top, doesn''t score enough. That said, I think he''d be good back-up if we struggle to sign strikers this year.

So, realistically, one of those will.

I''m interested to see what happens with Toffolo, I thought he was good enough to be part of the squad last season, obviously Olsson is our 1st choice, if Brady would be preferred to Toffolo surely we have to move him on if we''re not going to give him a chance?

[Bethnal Yellow and Green 1,557]

Must admit I didn''t realise the emergency loan ''loophole'' was being closed this season in the Football League. This will make a huge difference to the future of these players.

They could end up sitting around playing almost zero football as the club don''t want to risk losing them for at least half a season on loan, but they aren''t quite close enough to the team to actually get games.

I think Toffolo''s future will depend on how the club go about replacing Brady should he leave. If they sign another left back who is 23 - 25 then surely Toffolo will have to realise his path into the team is blocked. Out of all the young players he is the most confusing, looked good in pre-season and was okay at Swindon, but then failed to make any impact at Rotherham and Posh.

Ultimately, whether the Murphys, Morris and Toffolo stay or go is largely down to them. If they are happy to go out on season long loans again then I''m sure Norwich will be happy to keep them on the books and loan them out (if they aren''t needed for the first team). If they want a permanent move in order to get a bit more certainty in their careers they may push to be sold.

[curious yellow 184]

I am surprised the Murphys haven''t got longer comtracts.

The club should be looking at this.

[Tetteys Jig 830]

For the Murphys, it''s becoming a bit now or never. Yes it''s hard to give youth a go when we are constantly flirting with promotion/relegation but the talent they have, there is no reason to stop believing either can kick on and become effective premiership level players.

I have a feeling we will see them quite a lot preseason and then all being well, at least one will break into the first team soon.

Morris is the wildcard. Yes he had a slow start in Scotland but he ended the season really well and was playing in a weak side for that league so was never going to bag 20 goals. People laugh but spl isn''t that bad, perhaps league 1 standard with splatterings of lower championship. They liked him up there and if he can carry his momentum from the end of the season, he could force his way in to a spot where we are thinking on the ground at the moment.

Problem is, unlike the likes of Ipswich, we can''t afford to sacrifice risking dropping points like they can where for us it could be the difference between 2nd and 3rd.

We also have a far better and experienced squad and for now it would be tough to drop the likes of Brady and redmond for youth. People like leeds and Ipswich have no choice but to play theirs. Even if Brady and redmond leave, we will likely look to use the money on a proven replacement.

Perhaps we should use the funds to find timm a partner and get a decent keeper and hope the Murphys fill in the wing spots?

[Tetteys Jig 830]

*thin on the ground.

[norfolkngood 1,086]

i am a great believer in you can not judge any youngster until he players in OUR first team

he might slot in better than another team who knows ?

he will have better players around him than a lge 1 team

many players from big teams do not set the world alight on loan or in under 21''s

take Rashford when he played in under 21''s for man utd many people didn''t even notice him didn''t look a world beater plays in a better team man utd 1st team and has not looked back

Not saying every player will make it but be nice to see what murphys can do in OUR team also morris lets face it we are in a easier league than the EPL and if they can not get in the team then they should be sold

i think it is terrible that our strikers scored so few last season would it of been such a bad thing to give a youngster a chance ,

we have seen it before a youngster comes in full of desire passion plays no fear and scores

[ZLF 271]

based on what we have seen so far (mainly on loan and under Adams) I would say that I am not convinced any are yet ready for a regular start in a promotion hunting side.

However they are good squad players to and you would hope that the best will make the bench regularly & be allowed to make their case as the season goes on and its then up to them to take their chance.

The emergency loan situation is an added challenge - easier for prem clubs as they are used to declaring their hands early but definitely a barrier to development for the youngsters & fitness creation. All seems to support a move to get "B" teams into the league if you ask me...

[GJP 79]

But it is worth noting that the Man Utd coaching staff always thought Rashford had a real shot - even if he has come out of nowhere to most fans.

[norfolkngood 1,086]

i forgot who said it but a Manager said that once a player reaches 21 its a crossroads either play for your parent club or leave and drop down to play first team for a lesser club

because players over 21 take up a squad place it really is make or break for murphy brothers

sending them out on loan for another season will not help club or player

[Yellowbeagle 0]

[quote user="ZippersLeftFoot"]based on what we have seen so far (mainly on loan and under Adams) I would say that I am not convinced any are yet ready for a regular start in a promotion hunting side.

However they are good squad players to and you would hope that the best will make the bench regularly & be allowed to make their case as the season goes on and its then up to them to take their chance.

The emergency loan situation is an added challenge - easier for prem clubs as they are used to declaring their hands early but definitely a barrier to development for the youngsters & fitness creation. All seems to support a move to get "B" teams into the league if you ask me...[/quote]

The B team idea might suit the prem clubs, but there is more to it than that. Infact I''d go as far as to say the league clubs who play in Those divisions have a bigger right of say and the last time the idea was mooted they were rightly imo against the idea.

Making more room for premier league clubs to stockpile players while weakening the league system at the same time is not the way to go.

[Woodman 92]

"Making more room for premier league clubs to stockpile players while weakening the league system at the same time is not the way to go."

Hear, hear! I saw someone post on here that Chelsea have something like 80+ players registered with them, and Man City probably have a similar number. The gulf between the have''s and the have not''s continues to grow.

[cornish sam 940]

I''m firmly against the removal of the ''emergency'' loan window for some of the reasons stated above, all it will serve to do is reduce some player development, weaken the lower leagues and potentially be the straw that breaks the financial camels back at some clubs as they have to carry a larger roster of players ''just in case''. However, this isn''t a conspiracy by the FA or the PL to get B teams into the league, this has been due to happen for a long time. We had special dispensation from FIFA that meant it was there in the first place, the time limit on that has just run out on it and the transfer windows are being strictly enforced.

[hertfordyellow 460]

I''ve noticed the Murphy''s have featured in a number of off season training videos on twitter over the last few weeks (fitness, shooting, first touch). If these are recent videos then they really do deserve a chance as that shows real desire IMHO.

[lake district canary 4,531]

Have either of the Murphys featured for the first team since AN has been here, perhaps in a cup game?  Can''t off hand think of one, perhaps pre-season last year,  but their chances of being included this year must be greater than last season, without the pressure of the premier league.  Would be fantastic to see one or both established in the squad and contributing this season, rather than seeing them do it for another team.  As for Morris, he will have been kept a good watch over with our contacts there. Good luck to him too.

[lake district canary 4,531]

*contacts at Hamilton