Is it the manager?... Or the Dressing room?

[Trent Canary 0]

Ive been watching soccer saturday, thinking about how I was going to throw my weight into the Worthy-out Category. Until about ten minutes ago an interesting text arrived on my phone. I dont want to post anything exact  but it sounds as though there are some big problems in our dressing room, problems between our players that lie far beyond our manager. But as Ive suggested, hearing these things tells me that we have big problems WHOEVER is in charge.

On the ball city.

[TheMarshmallowMan 0]

[quote]Ive been watching soccer saturday, thinking about how I was going to throw my weight into the Worthy-out Category. Until about ten minutes ago an interesting text arrived on my phone. I dont want to p...[/quote]

If we have problems in our dressing room we need a manager who will sort it out.

[Trent Canary 0]

[quote]If we have problems in our dressing room we need a manager who will sort it out.[/quote]

I agree, but right now it appears as though the players just arent getting along. I just hope all the facts from behind the scenes will emerge before any major renovation of our Management or squad occurs.

[Trent Canary 0]

[quote]I agree, but right now it appears as though the players just arent getting along. I just hope all the facts from behind the scenes will emerge before any major renovation of our Management or squad oc...[/quote]

Although Im pretty sure I now have one foot firmly entrenched in the OUT brigade.

George Burley? Im licking my lips..  Although just to let everyone know.. IT WONT HAPPEN!! Sorry, but we can only dream.

[Scot-e-dog 34]

[quote]If we have problems in our dressing room we need a manager who will sort it out.[/quote]

I''ll second that. While you might can''t really hold the manager responsible for problems that start, it''s certainly his responsibility for stopping them before they become a problem.

Having said that, I should make it clear that I''m not part of the Worthy out campaign, but I''m getting pretty close.

I no longer live in Norwich and can''t afford to travel to games, so I''m not best qualified to complain anyway, but what I do know is that it''s getting pretty embarrassing going to work these days.

[Mark .Y. 351]

" dont want to post anything exact  but it sounds as though there are some big problems in our dressing room, problems between our players"

 

Come on Trent, you can''t leave it at that........if you are scared of libelling somebody, just don''t mention any names. We NEED to know, this season is becoming one of the worst of my life (we have been worse but this year we had high expectations/hopes), so please let us in on it. If I could understand what was happening it MIGHT make football a bit easier to bear at the moment.

Mark .Y.

 

[Trent Canary 0]

[quote]" dont want to post anything exact but it sounds as though there are some big problems in our dressing room, problems between our players" Come on Trent, you can''t leave it at that........if you ...[/quote]

Neil Adams just now on Radio Norfolk was talking about Mike Bassett (The TV show) and footballers wives. The other bloke on Radio Norfolk whos name escapes me asked if the shows are anything like what goes on in real life, Neil said something along the lines of one of the shows being quite close to reality. Not much of a clue, but make of it what you will Mark. This message board is well moderated, which is a good thing, Id love to go into it further, but I cant.

[Crazy Eddie 0]

[quote]Neil Adams just now on Radio Norfolk was talking about Mike Bassett (The TV show) and footballers wives. The other bloke on Radio Norfolk whos name escapes me asked if the shows are anything like what...[/quote]

I know exactly what you are driving at and am pretty sure on the individuals concerned but it''s not something we can talk about. As you say, this is a well moderated board.

[ron obvious 1,501]

You rotten tease!

If you REALLY DO know something ( & you''re one of the posters I would trust), then you can''t just leave it at that!

You don''t have to be specific, just a few generalisations would help ...

I am beginning to think there is something going on - I have no prejudices as to what it might be, but the silence is becoming deafening ...

[ron obvious 1,501]

Typical! The well-known law of Sod is infallible. I''ve been refreshing like mad to see if TC replied, then as soon as I try to provoke a response, one appears!

Web team: obviously no need to post previous mesage!

Poor bloke, though, if it''s that sort of problem.

Perhaps Fatman Fat can advise on how to manage his way out of that one ..

[Oso Butch 0]

I agree with the others. Trent Canary can''t just make an observation on the Forum as if it''s a fact but be vague about it and just leave us all guessing.  Wot about those of us who don''t watch Footballers'' Wives?  Wot are we supposed to make of the ''clues''??? 

I''ve heard from more than one source recently that some players [moderator - players names removed - sorry] have real problems with Mr W.  Presumably the feelings are mutual. We''ve seen this before.  If Mr W doesn''t like a player, for wotever reason, they suddenly become ''persona non grata'' - or, in simple terms, he won''t select them, whatever the circumstances.  To me, that''s arrogance and if a manager can''t rise above it, he shouldn''t be in charge.  NCFC is bigger than any one person, including (if not especially) the manager....

But, Trent Canary, if on top of all that, you are saying there are other problems behind the scenes - as well as general manager ineptitude, tactical incompetence and pig-headedness - then please be more specific - or don''t make the accusation/observation.  This is all too serious...  We''re 17th in the league and falling....

On the Burley, City......!

[Trent Canary 0]

[quote]I agree with the others. Trent Canary can''t just make an observation on the Forum as if it''s a fact but be vague about it and just leave us all guessing. Wot about those of us who don''t watch Footbal...[/quote]

Butch, as you have seen with your post, the moderators have the power to edit things. Believe me if I thought that my post would come up unedited then I would say it, but It would be edited, and its a good thing, as I still dont know the full details, and I dont want to come out and say stuff thats not true. For now you will have to sit tight, things tend to come out eventually

And no I dont watch footballers wives either

[Scot-e-dog 34]

I am assuming these rumours go beyond the old "ex player", "current player" tittle-tattle of ages ago.I must be honest, I''m only itching to know out of pure idle curiosity. This is really the business of the individuals concerned (if true) and only becomes the clubs business if it affects the team.Do we know if these is one of the factots impacting the on the pitch performances?

[Oso Butch 0]

The really sad thing is that a number of us - scattered across the country (I live near Cambridge - a 150 mile round trip to every home game, let alone the away games - and I presume that Trent Canary has got to be Nottingham way?) - are clearly picking up stories from our various contacts throughout the UK that things are not at all good behind the scenes at Carrow Road. News travels fast...

For me, what was particularly depressing today was to see Green and Ashton bad-mouthing each other after the third goal.  Green presumably thought that either Doc or Deano should have done better with their defensive header (both went for the same ball and Dean got it out to the edge of the area - at least he was back defending...!!!) and Deano (justifiably, IMO) felt that Greeno could have saved the resulting shot.  What we witnessed today was major frustation all round but to see it between 2 of our best players to the degree it was on show was distinctly worrying....

IMO, only a change of manager can turn things round now....

On the ball, Burley!!!

[Trent Canary 0]

[quote]I am assuming these rumours go beyond the old "ex player", "current player" tittle-tattle of ages ago.I must be honest, I''m only itching to know out of pure idle curiosity. This is really the busines...[/quote]

"Do we know if these is one of the factors impacting the on the pitch performances?"

Scot-E .. Thats what I was getting at in my first post, im worried that everyone is advocating the sacking of Worthy, when it may be more down to other parties. If they arent playing together as a team, then I dont know many managers that would be able to get them too. At least there arent any more "Lets get Burley!" threads today, we must have reached double digits yesterday!

[mr.carrow 0]

What ever the gossip is I think we have to look at our players, at no point during training our in his pre-match talk can I imagine Worthy telling the players to perform like that

[breaker 0]

Actually Mr Carrow you are completely wrong - I was passing the dressing room just before kick off and I distincly heard NW say,"Greeny, try and dive over a couple more shots today and have a go at Sore-Head Ashton at some point as well. Deano make sure your shots miss the goal by at least 10 yards, not like that poor effort that went in on Tuesday night! Brenno, Charlio and little boy on the wing who I don''t really like, work hard and run around a lot - don''t worry about touching the ball but if you do just boot it away in the general direction of Darren (lovely boy). Oh and McVeigho you will be hauled off at half time as per normal. Finally Gary & Calum, GET YOUR HEADS OUT OF THE WAY OF ANY INCOMING CROSS, or I will be forced into playing Jason ''bad back'' Shackell. JJ - make sure you are ready and fully warmed up - we will need lots of cups of tea throughout the second half. Go out and enjoy the game."

[Canary Poirot 1]

I''m with Trent Canary on this one. The manager has only so much control over the players. Yes he sets the training schedule, he motivates them, he picks the team and the tactics, but when the players run over that white line it is then THEIR responsibility to perform, and the manager has limited control over what they do.

I personally have played football at a reasonably high level, and been coached by professionals. I can tell you there is a world of difference to that than what you might be used to if you''ve only ever played Sunday league football or school football. And yes the team talks are given. But like I said - you as a player have the responsibility to do your job on the pitch. Sometimes, in the heat of the moment, you act on impulse and ignore the manager''s directions - it happens. The fact of the matter is that we can all sit here and blame the manager as he has ultimate responsibility for results, but when the players perform so ineptly - and yes it was the players, then they should take the flak, and part of the responsibility for the abysmal performances. Quite frankly, if I came into the club tomorrow, I would tell one or two of them they had a month to impress or their contract would be torn up. The players neeed to be reminded that there are plenty of guys out there who want professional contracts - if they''re not doing it, maybe the others will.  Do they not have any pride in their profession? Some of them need the hairdryer treatment. Some of them need to be given a two week break to think seriously about why their form has collapsed in the last 18 months (germany? - give me a break son). Those who don''t want to be here should be dropped, permenently and sold in January - and I don''t care who they are. The players are handsomly rewarded for playing professional football - and for me, too many of them at the moment are an absolute disgrace to their profession.

Also there has been criticism from many on here about the use of Simon Charlton in midfield - effectively playing out of position when Jarrett is available (allegedly) and Rossi Jarvis on the bench. The problem with playing youth is that in the current climate one poor display from Rossi Jarvis could destroy his confidence (unless of course he is like Craig Bellamy and has huge self belief) - it is very risky. And maybe the fact of the matter is that Charlton is actually better than Jarrett!

 

[sheded 0]

[quote]I''m with Trent Canary on this one. The manager has only so much control over the players. Yes he sets the training schedule, he motivates them, he picks the team and the tactics, but when the players ...[/quote]

Thats exactly what  I had in mind to say Forum , but you  just said it better than I could !  ....   just to add to it though , I can say that all through last season  there`s beeen evidence  of discord between players  !!   there`s something festering away in the  background here ,  and its so serious that its now beyond Nigels power to control .....  which suggests that its not just the players who  are creating problem .. !   could it be that  the knives  are out  from the " establishment "   of    traning staff  ?   could it be that Nigel   and the " establishment "  are at loggerheads ? it would fit the pattern emerging  !!  

[Syteanric 1]

what a load of Codswallop!!!

If Neil Adams said that we were going to sign Ronaldinho, Beckham and Totti tommorow would u treat those as "clues"?

Adams said it as a light hearted joke.... the only reason that some players might be arguing is that some support worthy and others dont!

its just peoples overactive imaginations.. they need to get out more!

jas

[a1canary 0]

[quote]what a load of Codswallop!!! If Neil Adams said that we were going to sign Ronaldinho, Beckham and Totti tommorow would u treat those as "clues"? Adams said it as a light hearted joke.... the only r...[/quote]

I''m sure that''s exactly it jas. Some support the manager, some don''t, and when things get really bad, those differences and disagreements are magnified a hundered times to the extent that there might be serious unrest in the dressing room.

Since Trent can''t/won''t tell us anything, we''ll have to do what any proper british rag would do in the same situation, take a best guess!! Now we''ve already determined that it''s most likely as simple as a pro manager and an anti manager divide in the dressing room. But where is that divide?

Here''s my guess:

Pro - Huckerby, Ashton, Hughes, Safri, Mckenzie

Against - McVeigh, Charlton, Green, Brennan, Henderson, Fleming

On the fence - Drury, Doherty, Jarrett

Generally speaking, it''s the players worthy has brought in AND that have figured prominently in his teams, versus some of the academy lot and those that have largely been bit part players under worthy. i''m sure WLY has some simmering anger at missing out almost entirely on getting a crack at the prem, while if Brennan''s performance against QPR is anything to go by, he''s clearly not switcehd on. His career at norwich has never really progressed in four years!  Charlton can''t be at all happy at playing out of position. Fleiming is an intersting one - one of the old guard, don''t know what makes me think he''d be against really. Henderson bound to be after never quite getting a long enough go in the team while greeno is just not there mentally. He''s a legend but i can''t help feeling he needs to move on in jan ''cos he''s not doing us or himself any favours at the moment.

what do people think?