Tetteys Jig 830 Posted January 7, 2016 Both from what i''ve watched live and from the stats books, it seems clear that we''ve done a lot better with Brady in at left back.I found an article on Worst team of the year which has Olsson as the worst left back in the league so far which I think is a bit unfair, but quite telling at the same time:http://www.matchpint.co.uk/sports-blog/about-worst-team-of-the-seaoson-thus-far-2015-16-1073We are all well aware of Olssons strengths marauding down the left and swinging in a cross but there''s a lot to his defensive game that could be worked on, "Pass accuracy of 69% for the season" "he sits bottom of the pile with regards to tackles completed and second bottom in terms of interceptions per game." Whilst they are just statistics and there''s more to it, they are pretty damning.I remember being pleasantly surprised with Brady defensively in the opening game against a tricky winger who got the better of him just once that afternoon despite the constant pressure down that side.Funnily enough, Brady scores 7.29, our highest rated player this season by a distance. It does keep me wondering if Olsson would be worth a try on the left wing with less defensive responsibility. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
morty 0 Posted January 7, 2016 As we charge headfirst into the second half of the season, it’s probably time for the annual barrage of hugely selective stats and libel claims waiting to happen that is our Worst Team Of The Season Thus Far. LB – Martin Olsson Average Rating – 6.48 Remember when Norwich got relegated in 2014 with a back four smellier than some kind of cheese and sewage pie? Remember when they got promoted and decided that a year in the Championship was exactly the thing that would turn the defensive turkeys from last time into bona fide, clean sheet fanciers. One shutout from 18 attempts makes its own argument for the success of this policy. On the left flank Olsson, and his appallingly warped view of what life in modern England is actually like (he’s only ever played for Blackburn and Norwich), has been stinking the place out with his unique brand of flaky defensive play and piss poor use of the football. Pass accuracy of 69% for the season makes me sick to the back teeth whilst you’ll no doubt be thrilled to hear that of all the PL left backs to make as least as many appearances as him this season, he sits bottom of the pile with regards to tackles completed and second bottom in terms of interceptions per game. IS NOTHING SACRED ANYMORE? Did You Know? - Olsson’s sister is married to German NBA legend Dirk Nowitzki. Here’s a picture of the Dallas Mavericks power forward looking totally normal and at ease during the traditional Kenyan wedding ceremony he and his wife Jessica had.Nadir Thus Far – Olsson endured a really super crap day at the office on Saturday as Norwich were roundly beaten 3-0 by Spurs. As well as the rather pressing matter of ‘all the goals’ there was also the thorny issue of Olsson managing to complete a whopping 15 passes in 90 minutes of football to mull over.Wow, thats a pretty informative source you have plucked out there! Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
grefstad 0 Posted January 7, 2016 Interesting. Never seen this article, but I am glad it brings facts to my opinions about Olsson likely being the worst LB in the league.I have received a lot of flak for that in this forum, but it pleases me that I seem to be right.My issues with Olsson has been more about his poor positioning, and his weaknesses 1 vs 1. I did not know he was bottom of the pile for tackles completed, and second bottom for interceptions, but it sure is no surprise.Hard to harass a left back for losing headers, but I can not remember seeing Olsson win many headers, and his usual opponents, wingers, are rarely good headers of the ball...Olsson is not good enough defensively, but can surely be tried in more offensive positions, I agree. He has probably got a part to play in this Norwich team as a straight left mid, or sometimes as a left winger, but I think bot he, and the team, is better off with Olsson benched than playing as a LB for us. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
morty 0 Posted January 7, 2016 Awwww, have you two teamed up now?[:)] Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Tetteys Jig 830 Posted January 7, 2016 "Unlike most MatchPint ‘articles’ there’s some vague method to this one - it’s decided on the ratings doled by the footy stat wizards at WhoScored. We pick an XI made up of players who’ve featured regularly this year (min 10 Premier League appearances), those with the worst accumulative season rating make the cut.*"There''s more substance than their usual articles apparently. People can have their own opinions, but i''ve been a lot more confident when seeing Brady lineup at left back. It''ll be interesting to see where Jarvis slots in when he''s back. I personally think that could be Olsson sat on the bench for a decent period though. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
morty 0 Posted January 7, 2016 [quote user="Tetteys Jig"]"Unlike most MatchPint ‘articles’ there’s some vague method to this one - it’s decided on the ratings doled by the footy stat wizards at WhoScored. We pick an XI made up of players who’ve featured regularly this year (min 10 Premier League appearances), those with the worst accumulative season rating make the cut.*"There''s more substance than their usual articles apparently. People can have their own opinions, but i''ve been a lot more confident when seeing Brady lineup at left back. It''ll be interesting to see where Jarvis slots in when he''s back. I personally think that could be Olsson sat on the bench for a decent period though.[/quote]I don''t disagree with the premise that we play a different way with Brady at left back.But that article is just awful.And I still don''t get why people spend time trying to prove the team they support is terrible. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
grefstad 0 Posted January 7, 2016 I see Matchpint in this article has Ruddy on the "bench2 for worst performers so far.Bench Of Dismay – John Ruddy, Maya Yoshida, Craig Gardner, Seb Larsson, Scot Sinclair, Kelechi Iheanacho, Papis Demba Cisse. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
morty 0 Posted January 7, 2016 You must be delighted.... Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Tetteys Jig 830 Posted January 7, 2016 It''s more a case of saying we are better with Brady there, not that we''re terrible in the slightest. It goes along with what AN has been seemingly thinking recently though with Ruddy dropped and Olsson replaced at left back with Brady despite Jarvis still being out and Redmond/ Wes/ Howson asked to shuffle around a bit as a result.Perhaps this is why Redmond has lost a bit of his spark in recent weeks, he''s been increasingly used on the left when he''s a natural right winger. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
morty 0 Posted January 7, 2016 [quote user="Tetteys Jig"]It''s more a case of saying we are better with Brady there, not that we''re terrible in the slightest. It goes along with what AN has been seemingly thinking recently though with Ruddy dropped and Olsson replaced at left back with Brady despite Jarvis still being out and Redmond/ Wes/ Howson asked to shuffle around a bit as a result.Perhaps this is why Redmond has lost a bit of his spark in recent weeks, he''s been increasingly used on the left when he''s a natural right winger.[/quote]Sooooo you wanted to make a thread about how we are better with Brady at left back and quoted a (terrible) article about the worst team of the season so far.Okie doke[Y]Could it be that we deploy a formation that includes Olsson for the tougher games perhaps? Which is always going to make his stats look worse, for an example of that see your awful article talking about the Spurs game. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Tetteys Jig 830 Posted January 7, 2016 I suppose the point i''m trying to make is that whilst Brady is an incredibly effective player for us going forward when played on the left wing, is he more needed at the back where Olsson has been struggling.http://www.whoscored.com/Players/93473/Going on his profile on here, he''s played most of his games at left back but his most effective games were at attacking mid so we have a bit of a catch 22 situation. I wonder if this Pinto fella can play left back?There''s probably a bit to be said about Olsson playing the tougher teams to be fair as well. The article may be hashed up from whoscored data with not a lot else, but the stats are pretty telling and can''t be completely dismissed.He''s a cracking attacking full back, but perhaps while we''re a smaller fish, we need someone a bit more solid. Brady has surprised me this season with how well he copes with winning headers and he has the energy that Olsson has so can get up and down well enough as well. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
morty 0 Posted January 7, 2016 [quote user="Tetteys Jig"]I suppose the point i''m trying to make is that whilst Brady is an incredibly effective player for us going forward when played on the left wing, is he more needed at the back where Olsson has been struggling.http://www.whoscored.com/Players/93473/Going on his profile on here, he''s played most of his games at left back but his most effective games were at attacking mid so we have a bit of a catch 22 situation. I wonder if this Pinto fella can play left back?There''s probably a bit to be said about Olsson playing the tougher teams to be fair as well. The article may be hashed up from whoscored data with not a lot else, but the stats are pretty telling and can''t be completely dismissed.He''s a cracking attacking full back, but perhaps while we''re a smaller fish, we need someone a bit more solid. Brady has surprised me this season with how well he copes with winning headers and he has the energy that Olsson has so can get up and down well enough as well.[/quote]Stats rarely tell the whole story though, do they?And they can be used to back up, or make pretty much any opinion you want.Your opinion is that Olsson is a poor left back, my opinion is that he is more likely to be played in the games against better teams. Its a bit like Whittaker, I actually like the guy, but I do recognise that he can only be played against lesser teams, because his attacking is always going to leave him exposed against better players.But theres a choice to be made there, a balance to be struck between defensive solidity and overlapping attacks, Brady does both pretty well, but I don''t see how that makes Olsson a terrible left back. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Tetteys Jig 830 Posted January 7, 2016 Poor would be a harsh word. I have said he''s good at getting forward and putting a good cross in and always a willing runner. I am not sure he suits our current style of football though like Brady seems to at left back.Olsson doesn''t seem to win enough in the air or retain the ball well enough for a side that often will have less than 50% possession and be soaking up a lot of pressure whereas Brady has proven he is responsible with the ball bar a few careless long range shots in the final third.I guess it is a bit like Whittaker, who has probably forged the best understanding with Nathan Redmond as highlighted at Wembley but he has his obvious drawbacks i.e. pace that makes him easy fodder for the opposition.As for the stats, you''re right, you can twist them this way and that. They are used by the professional clubs and are there for all to see though and I wouldn''t call 69.7% passing particularly good for a left back whatever the situation.What would you do with Olsson? I''m not sure he provides the solidarity we need against most teams at this level. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Thirsty Lizard 3,158 Posted January 7, 2016 My brother who lives in London came up to the Everton match with two Everton fans who work at the same place as him. After the match they said to him that Olsson was one of the best left backs they''d seen this season. They were particularly impressed with the way (as they put it) that he gave Deulofeu a quiet kicking. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
morty 0 Posted January 7, 2016 [quote user="Tetteys Jig"]Poor would be a harsh word. I have said he''s good at getting forward and putting a good cross in and always a willing runner. I am not sure he suits our current style of football though like Brady seems to at left back.Olsson doesn''t seem to win enough in the air or retain the ball well enough for a side that often will have less than 50% possession and be soaking up a lot of pressure whereas Brady has proven he is responsible with the ball bar a few careless long range shots in the final third.I guess it is a bit like Whittaker, who has probably forged the best understanding with Nathan Redmond as highlighted at Wembley but he has his obvious drawbacks i.e. pace that makes him easy fodder for the opposition.As for the stats, you''re right, you can twist them this way and that. They are used by the professional clubs and are there for all to see though and I wouldn''t call 69.7% passing particularly good for a left back whatever the situation.What would you do with Olsson? I''m not sure he provides the solidarity we need against most teams at this level.[/quote]Playing against some of the best attacking players in the world though? I am not making him out to be perfect, but I don''t particularly see theres anything that needs to be done about him, or particularly see him as a problem.Frankly, defensively, as a whole, we are only, in recent games, starting to find a better formula, you could pick fault with anyone across the back 5 based on the first half of the season, if you so wished to. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Tetteys Jig 830 Posted January 7, 2016 I guess I meant that going forward, when Jarvis is back, would you see a way back to the 11 for Olsson? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
morty 0 Posted January 7, 2016 [quote user="Tetteys Jig"]I guess I meant that going forward, when Jarvis is back, would you see a way back to the 11 for Olsson?[/quote]Yes.We are a squad that has very few players that are so good, that they are suited to every single match. I don''t see Olsson as a problem, more of a different option, depending on the opposition. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
grefstad 0 Posted January 7, 2016 Olsson will still have a part to play, obviously, but with Jarvis back, I expect Olsson to be benched more often than not for the remainder of the season.Even against the stronger sides, I think Brady will be preferred as the LB Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Jacko 0 Posted January 7, 2016 If Olsson is that bad then why did Tony Pulis attempt to buy him a year ago. Say what you want about Pulis but he does know how to put a defence together.Olsson has his flaws, he allows far too many crosses into the box for my liking but, by and large, for me he''s a competent enough Premier League full back. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Bethnal Yellow and Green 1,557 Posted January 7, 2016 Whilst Robbie Brady has been an improvement on Olsson in the last couple of games, who has certainly not been at his best in recent weeks (months possibly), it is a shame to lose Brady from the attack.Whilst Jarvis was good in a couple of games before his injury, he certainly didn''t offer the attacking qualities of Brady. I wouldn''t mind seeing Norwich sign another left back to challenge Olsson and leave Brady in his best position. However, it certainly isn''t as vital as signing a new centre back and striker. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
ZLF 273 Posted January 7, 2016 this thread seems to be about personalities rather than the question posed.I dont think olsson is a bad player, in the same way I dont think martin is either. Its just that we have better alternatives too them in their positions. Both are good squad players to have and right now Brady is the superior left back for us, balancing attacking and defending duties more effectively than any other full back on either flank.Bethnals point is spot on; a more dedicated left back is needed, but its a lower priority for me too; behind striker & CB in particular Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Deptford Canary 0 Posted January 8, 2016 [quote user="ZippersLeftFoot"]this thread seems to be about personalities rather than the question posed.I dont think olsson is a bad player, in the same way I dont think martin is either. Its just that we have better alternatives too them in their positions. Both are good squad players to have and right now Brady is the superior left back for us, balancing attacking and defending duties more effectively than any other full back on either flank.Talking of dedicated left backs - I wonder where things are at with the very promising Hary Toffolo... (Also capable at CB). ??Bethnals point is spot on; a more dedicated left back is needed, but its a lower priority for me too; behind striker & CB in particular[/quote] Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
nutty nigel 7,526 Posted January 8, 2016 So going by these stats who''s the better fullback out of Olsson and Whittaker? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
ZLF 273 Posted January 8, 2016 My view is Whittaker offers a more effective attacking threat but olsson is the better defender. His pace is a strength but not that effectively used.Both good footballers but I would say Whittaker''s gap to the required standard for us in the prem is larger than olssons. Very happy to have either as squad players but just need a little better than either for the starting XI Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Tetteys Jig 830 Posted January 8, 2016 [quote user="Bethnal Yellow and Green"]Whilst Robbie Brady has been an improvement on Olsson in the last couple of games, who has certainly not been at his best in recent weeks (months possibly), it is a shame to lose Brady from the attack.Whilst Jarvis was good in a couple of games before his injury, he certainly didn''t offer the attacking qualities of Brady. I wouldn''t mind seeing Norwich sign another left back to challenge Olsson and leave Brady in his best position. However, it certainly isn''t as vital as signing a new centre back and striker.[/quote]My point entirely bethnal before the typical detractors had their say. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
nutty nigel 7,526 Posted January 9, 2016 [quote user="ZippersLeftFoot"]My view is Whittaker offers a more effective attacking threat but olsson is the better defender. His pace is a strength but not that effectively used.Both good footballers but I would say Whittaker''s gap to the required standard for us in the prem is larger than olssons. Very happy to have either as squad players but just need a little better than either for the starting XI[/quote] We''re not far apart Zip. But I think the only differenced between Olsson and Whittaker is that Whits is braver going forward which of course makes him more vulnerable defensively. Whits suited Alex Neil''s philosophy to a tee. Which is why he playerd practically every game. Until Newcastle when Alex decided to ditch certain aspects of our play. Not sure what Jig''s reference to detractors is all about. But if it was my post then I don''t get what the problem is. I''d still be interested in what those stats say to compare Whittaker to Olsson. I suspect they are not far apart. And surely would not back up the perception that appears on here sometimes where Olsson should be POTS whilst Whittaker is a total liability. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Tetteys Jig 830 Posted January 9, 2016 [quote user="nutty nigel"][quote user="ZippersLeftFoot"]My view is Whittaker offers a more effective attacking threat but olsson is the better defender. His pace is a strength but not that effectively used.Both good footballers but I would say Whittaker''s gap to the required standard for us in the prem is larger than olssons. Very happy to have either as squad players but just need a little better than either for the starting XI[/quote] We''re not far apart Zip. But I think the only differenced between Olsson and Whittaker is that Whits is braver going forward which of course makes him more vulnerable defensively. Whits suited Alex Neil''s philosophy to a tee. Which is why he playerd practically every game. Until Newcastle when Alex decided to ditch certain aspects of our play. Not sure what Jig''s reference to detractors is all about. But if it was my post then I don''t get what the problem is. I''d still be interested in what those stats say to compare Whittaker to Olsson. I suspect they are not far apart. And surely would not back up the perception that appears on here sometimes where Olsson should be POTS whilst Whittaker is a total liability.  [/quote] Nowt to do with you mate, no worries. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites