Hooper going?

[Branston Pickle 3,638]

I''m not sure of those stats, and using only ''starts'' for him is rather misleading though - a fair proportion of Hooper''s goals have come from the subs bench: he''s actually scored 18 in 64 league games.

The problem with him was that when he started games he hardly ever had the impact needed. Tbh I don''t really have much of an opinion either way, but just because he''s scored against a god-awful Bolton side doesn''t mean we should either keep or sell.

[CanaryOne 0]

Played the right way still by far the best goalscorer we have at the club , i would not sell anybody else untill we get somebody in which is proving just as hard as the summer window .

[Clint 221]

That''s true Morty but he didn''t do too badly last season and he wasn''t a massively regular starter. Maybe he just has to be in the right frame of mind to keep himself fit!

[morty 0]

[quote user="Clint"]That''s true Morty but he didn''t do too badly last season and he wasn''t a massively regular starter. Maybe he just has to be in the right frame of mind to keep himself fit![/quote]I would certainly hang on to him till we buy something else, he''d be a good option off the bench just now. His loan is up now, be interesting to see what happens next.

[Katie Borkins 1]

Bournemouth £10m

[sonyc 5,492]

Shef We''d will offer the £3m is what will happen and we will hold out for 3.5m with add ons for promotion. We have named our price incredibly. For a Prem striker of his record 3.5m is a steal

[morty 0]

[quote user="Darth Bor"]Bournemouth £10m[/quote][:D]

[grefstad 0]

Hooper is OK in a 4-4-2 with a big man next to him. Norwich will never play like that in the Prem as our midfielders and defenders ate not mobile enough, so we would be too open.

Therefore Hooper is of little use to us, bar being a sub when we are chasing games late on.

His goals today will surely enable McNally to squeeze another 500k from Sheff Wed. 4.5 mill?

[Feedthewolf 4,844]

[quote user="grefstad"]Hooper is OK in a 4-4-2 with a big man next to him. Norwich will never play like that in the Prem as our midfielders and defenders ate not mobile enough, so we would be too open.

Therefore Hooper is of little use to us, bar being a sub when we are chasing games late on.

His goals today will surely enable McNally to squeeze another 500k from Sheff Wed. 4.5 mill?[/quote]It''s fair to say we have had our differences, Gref, but I agree with you 100% on this. I like Hooper as a player, but he simply doesn''t fit into the system here.

[PurpleCanary 5,554]

A few points. Despite what some posters are saying, as far as I know we have not put a price (at least not publicly) of £3.5m on Hooper. Secondly, do Sheffield Wednesday have that kind of money, if that is the price?  I have no idea. Thirdly, if we were initially thinking of offloading Hooper, that we have now been able to get rid of Grabban might alter our thinking (even though I take the point about Hooper not fitting into our usual system, but then Lafferty seems about as difficult to accommodate). Unless the aim is to get two new strikers to make a quartet (with Jerome and Mbokani) Hooper''s goalscoring, admittedly down a division, might be playing him back into contention for us.

[shefcanary 2,389]

Purple, the Wendy''s are now bankrolled by a Singaporean outfit (slightly better than Blackburn''s Benny''s, but essentially a similar background). The only limit is FFP (and the ambition of the manager) so price may not be as important as the structure of the deal and the related cash flows! Oh sand whether one of the executive boxes is available!

[shefcanary 2,389]

[quote user="shefcanary"]Purple, the Wendy''s are now bankrolled by a Singaporean outfit (slightly better than Blackburn''s Benny''s, but essentially a similar background). The only limit is FFP (and the ambition of the manager) so price may not be as important as the structure of the deal and the related cash flows! Oh sand whether one of the executive boxes is available![/quote]

For Benny''s read Venky''s (bloody autocorrect and manic typing.

[AJ 1,218]

I think he''s been unlucky this season, mainly because being a one man up top isn''t his strong suit. He''s a good player and quite possibly the best finisher we have at the club but as long as we play one up top he''s going to struggle for chances here. Would I sell him? No, not unless we bring in sometime better.

I certainly think now Grabban has gone that Lafferty might well end up staying now too

[morty 0]

The fact that journos on Twitter are saying the Naismith deal is looking in jeopardy could well change our requirement for Hooper.

[Nuff Said 5,092]

Did any of those journos also retweet the news that the Santayana deal was off?

[Hank shoots Skyler 2,094]

Always thought Hooper could have a future in the Hoolahan role for us, but never seemed like his heart was in it when it came to the dirty work- dropping back to help the midfield, pressing the ball etc.

Everything about him technically was premier league class though IMO.

[morty 0]

[quote user="Nuff Said"]Did any of those journos also retweet the news that the Santayana deal was off?[/quote]Haha, no.I don''t know whats going on, but everyone, until very recently, was alluding to the fact it was pretty much a done deal, and Naismith was on his way, and it was just fixture congestion and / or getting someone else in that was stalling things at Everton''s end.Now I''m seeing Charlie Wyett ( usually pretty reliable) saying its all a bit in doubt now, and hearing rumblings that Swansea may be interested, and I am going to assume they will offer more money than us.I don''t want to get to the end of the window and hear "Yeah we bid on players, but the deals didn''t come off"Again.

[Branston Pickle 3,638]

It ought to be a total no-brainer that we let no one else go unless and until we have replacements in place.

I don''t doubt that we will have new faces coming in (at the very least there seems to have been little point in making Jarvis a permanent if we don''t at least have a loan on the way), but we have managed to offload Grabban (barely a squad player in the end), and if we are left with a rejuvenated Hooper and a Lafferty chomping at the bit to prove his worth for NI in the Euros, then so be it. We should really concentrate a bit on defence (as should Eddie Howe!).

[Essjayess 307]

What Gref said is simply correct. If Hooper played in a system which benefits him and plays to his strengths he would score many goals for City. But plain truth is Alex seems hell bent on retaining the one up front style of formation so Hooper sadly is total waste of a striker at this club.  Sell him to Wednesday, who will find the money, and reatain Lafferty as 3rd  striker. We dont need any other strikers, 3 is enough for the sole 1 man up front. Alex has to find that magic ingredient of supplying one man up there with the chances to score.Also dont need Mr. Naismith or any other midfielders, just strengthen our central defence, please?

[morty 0]

[quote user="Essjayess"]What Gref said is simply correct. If Hooper played in a system which benefits him and plays to his strengths he would score many goals for City. But plain truth is Alex seems hell bent on retaining the one up front style of formation so Hooper sadly is total waste of a striker at this club.  Sell him to Wednesday, who will find the money, and reatain Lafferty as 3rd  striker. We dont need any other strikers, 3 is enough for the sole 1 man up front. Alex has to find that magic ingredient of supplying one man up there with the chances to score.Also dont need Mr. Naismith or any other midfielders, just strengthen our central defence, please?[/quote]You can only pi$$ with the cock you have.You play to the strengths of the team, if Hooper was genuinely good enough to build a team around, then we would. But fact he isn''t. But at a push he is still a good option off the bench, and I don''t think we should let him go just yet, until we see how the rest of the window pans out.No one plays two up front anymore, unless its against specifically weaker opposition. Which is why a genuine number 10 is worth his weight in gold.

[Essjayess 307]

Ithink Watford play two up and it works for them.  Could work for us to with the strength of midfield we have, but not without more steel and additions defensively.  If Hooper stayed i can see same old, same old again, him warming his posterior on the bench. He must be enjoying his renewed lease of life playing regularly at Wednesday, he may do a Grabban anyway and sulk for Wednesday if he  had to endure bench warming again.

[Redders Right Foot 22]

[quote user="Essjayess"]What Gref said is simply correct. If Hooper played in a system which benefits him and plays to his strengths he would score many goals for City. But plain truth is Alex seems hell bent on retaining the one up front style of formation so Hooper sadly is total waste of a striker at this club.  Sell him to Wednesday, who will find the money, and reatain Lafferty as 3rd  striker. We dont need any other strikers, 3 is enough for the sole 1 man up front. Alex has to find that magic ingredient of supplying one man up there with the chances to score.Also dont need Mr. Naismith or any other midfielders, just strengthen our central defence, please?[/quote]

I don''t think it''s so much as AN being hell bent on a certain style or formation, as shown by his changes in the tactics this season.

I think what it comes down to is - as good as he is, is Hooper a good enough player to form a team around? and for me it''s a no.

[jaemae2 0]

[quote user="Essjayess"]Ithink Watford play two up and it works for them.  Could work for us to with the strength of midfield we have, but not without more steel and additions defensively.  If Hooper stayed i can see same old, same old again, him warming his posterior on the bench. He must be enjoying his renewed lease of life playing regularly at Wednesday, he may do a Grabban anyway and sulk for Wednesday if he  had to endure bench warming again.[/quote]

Deeney really hasn''t remotely been playing as a striker or alongside Ighalo in any sense. They aren''t playing 2 up front.

[Paul101 93]

yes they are

unless the Watford game I watched the other day was in my mind

they are both very mobile so maybe the running out to the flanks confused you

but mostly watfords plan is very direct and fast moving verging on longball at times

[Katie Borkins 1]

Hooper is at least match fit now. Maybe an impact sub, I don''t know. Seems a bit desperate and AN has shown he doesn''t rate him so I expect a sale.

Surprised we can''t engineer a Lees plus cash deal (or vice versa)

[Barclay seats 4849 the 3rd 0]

Leicester also play two up front, as do many other teams when it suits . " everybody plays one up front " is over used cliche , which even the pundits poo poo these days .

[grefstad 0]

Watford is playing a 4-4-2, sometimes perhaps more like a 4-4-1-1 system, where Deeney is the hardworking carthorse dropping back to midfield, while Igalho is lurking up front, on the offside line.

Works well for them, but they have a very hardworking midfield, very mobile, lots of running power, which we dont have.

Yes, we play a 4-4-1-1 also, in many games, espesially when Wes plays, but a straight 4-4-2 for us seems to be abandoned by AN, at least as a starting formation, as AN seem to think it makes us too open (he is right).

We dont have mobile enough midfielders (with "engine") to play 4-4-2, and we seem to need the extra man in midfield to keep other teams at bay.

This is also widely used for other teams in the Prem.

Also, a 4-4-2 gives a bit more exposure for the central defenders, as they will get into more 1 vs 1 situations with a quick forward running at them, espescially if we are playing against a 5-man midfield capable of threading passes through the line between midfield and defence.

As we all know, our defence against pace is not very good...

So, in this context, Hooper will not fit in. Even as a withdrawn striker in a 4-4-1-1 (the Wes role), Hooper does not seem to have the energy, or will if you like, to drop back and help out when needed.

But as a striker, he is probably the most gifted player we got. He can stick the ball in the net, but the system we play restricts his opportunities in the line up.

Personally I think a 4-4-2 high energy setup could work well in the Premier, also against typical 4-2-3-1 setups, but it requires more mobile/hardworking players than we currently got, as well as 2 strikers that complement eachother, and can create their own chances. Watfords relative success story is built on this, and Leicester, even though not always playing 4-4-2, have also thrived on high energy football, winning the ball high in the pitch through energetic midfielders like Kante and workhorses like Drinkwater, and then countering through the blistering pace and individual skills of Mahrez and Vardy.

[Peanuts 150]

I think he''s a good finisher and the kind of striker with a knack for being in the right place at the right time, but I agree with what most are saying that he doesn''t seem to fit AN''s preferred way of playing.

Morty has a point that if AN thought he was good enough he''d build the team around him, and my impression has always been that AN isn''t convinced by his attitude or work ethic. I think he''s the kind of player who can be difficult to motivate if he can''t be the star of the show. The story about him wanting his own box at Wednesday may have been a load of nonsense, but the fact that it was reported at all suggests he has a reputation as a bit of a big time charlie.

If there''s a deal to done, I''d say sell but I''d like to see another striker sign, ideally better, not just different, than what we have.

[norfolkngood 1,086]

you find this a lot a player moves on loan finds a new lease of life feels wanted enjoying football wanting to earn a contract / move

when they sign the 3 year contract they go back to being comfortable this is how I feel about hooper he has got all the tools to be a premier player but has that drive and passion workrate you need ?

[Essjayess 307]

In the end it often comes down to money and what the manager thinks. Alex in the local papers today seems to be saying hes comfortable with City having Cam, Mbok and Lafferty as our strike force.  As regards the money side of things (cannot ignore that, this is NCFC  after all)  Hooper is on 32k a week wages if the reports are true, plus the fact hes out of contract  at end of season anyway? Seems the best thing is cash him in for 3 or 4 mill while we can, that would mean City saving the wages of Hooper, Grabban and E. Benno, not withstanding the 3 slots in the 25 these guys bring.There will be enough issues as it is in the summer, which division we will be in, the end of Mboks loan,  Ricky coming back (yet again lol), so i think it would be good if we had sorted both the Grabban and Hooper issues this window.