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Yellowhammer

It had to be us and poor management

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All the underdogs won apart from us ! If penalties were immanent why not put on Lafferty and jerome and what has lafferty got to do to earn a start

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That''s just idiotic: the sides playing at home won, perhaps that had something to do with it; we couldn''t bring a striker on when we''d already put our subs on - and it was two of our forward players who missed. Pens are a lottery, learn to live with it.

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[quote user="Branston Pickle"]That''s just idiotic: the sides playing at home won, perhaps that had something to do with it; we couldn''t bring a striker on when we''d already put our subs on - and it was two of our forward players who missed. Pens are a lottery, learn to live with it.[/quote]

Agreed the sides playing at home won but would not have bet on Sheff Wed or Stoke winning

PLUS AN had every opportunity to replace Grabban right up to the 90th minute as our subs came on in the 69th. 76th and the 90th minute

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Will be interesting to hear about the Wisdom/Whitts sub. If Wisdom was not injured,it was a ridiculous sub at the time.

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I would have bet on Stoke beating Chelsea. Stoke are a good team on a decent run whereas Chelsea are falling apart. And Sheff W team beating Arsenal reserves isn''t that much of a shock either.

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Sheff Wed are going to be there or thereabouts this season. With Hooper as well, they''ll be top six at least.

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Not many teams will go to Everton and win this season, they are a good unit under Martinez and when you look at their line up they have some tasty players.

Rather than lambasting us, I would take pride in the fact that we made 7 changes, looked better than them for periods, and were very close to nudging them out despite us being on a poor run defensively.

And Redmond and Hoolahan can join the list of awful players like Baggio, Beckham, Gerrard and Messi in missing spot kicks. Disappointing yes, but it happens to the best.

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[quote user="grefstad"]Will be interesting to hear about the Wisdom/Whitts sub. If Wisdom was not injured,it was a ridiculous sub at the time.[/quote]

Wisdom was absolutely shattered as he hasn''t had much football. Whittaker and Redmond looking very threatening down that right hand side in extra time. Indeed all our attacks of note were from that side. Whittaker also scored his penalty. So it wasn''t a ridiculous sub at all .

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If Wisdom was totally knackered, it is fair enough. If not, a player like Lafferty or Jerome, both on the bench, would be a better choice, instead of cruising to penalties....

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[quote user="grefstad"]If Wisdom was totally knackered, it is fair enough. If not, a player like Lafferty or Jerome, both on the bench, would be a better choice, instead of cruising to penalties....[/quote]Wisdom was also taken off due to tweaking his knee.Alex Neil said the substitution was forced, and he would much rather have made a more offensive substitution.

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Try watching or at least following a game every now and then Grefstad, then you''d realise Wisdom was both shattered and seemed to be carrying a knock. Then your naturally negative post wouldn''t have been required.

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[quote user="grefstad"]If Wisdom was totally knackered, it is fair enough. If not, a player like Lafferty or Jerome, both on the bench, would be a better choice, instead of cruising to penalties....[/quote]Neither team was ''cruising to penalties''. Both teams went for it in extra time. It was end-to-end the whole time. Both teams created chances. It was a great game to watch.If you want to be critical of the subs, albeit without knowing the full story - then that''s fine. But to claim that Norwich were ''cruising to penalties'' all because we didn''t put another striker on is completely inaccurate given the game I watched.

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[quote user="The ghost of Michael Theoklitos"][quote user="grefstad"]If Wisdom was totally knackered, it is fair enough. If not, a player like Lafferty or Jerome, both on the bench, would be a better choice, instead of cruising to penalties....[/quote]Neither team was ''cruising to penalties''. Both teams went for it in extra time. It was end-to-end the whole time. Both teams created chances. It was a great game to watch.If you want to be critical of the subs, albeit without knowing the full story - then that''s fine. But to claim that Norwich were ''cruising to penalties'' all because we didn''t put another striker on is completely inaccurate given the game I watched.[/quote]Agreed.Despite not getting in to beddy-bo''s till 4:15 this morning, it was a cracker of a game, I thoroughly enjoyed it, despite the result.And really, if I''m honest, I''m not hugely gutted we''re out of the cup.

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Personally Morty, I was bit gutted as they invested a lot into that game and I thought they deserved to progress. But crucially, they were back to moving the ball as well as they did at West Ham. Long may it continue!

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[quote user="Jacko"]Personally Morty, I was bit gutted as they invested a lot into that game and I thought they deserved to progress. But crucially, they were back to moving the ball as well as they did at West Ham. Long may it continue![/quote]Yeah, I agree in the fact that they played well enough to expect something from the game.But in the bigger picture these points were more important, for me :-Mulumbu, looked great and gained fitness.Ofoe, again, looked good, very strong, and could give us another dimension in midfield.Rudd, Genuine contender for the no1 shirt.Bassong and Bennett, looked very calm and reassured.

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[quote user="hogesar"]Try watching or at least following a game every now and then Grefstad, then you''d realise Wisdom was both shattered and seemed to be carrying a knock. Then your naturally negative post wouldn''t have been required.[/quote]

Well. Hog, awake after the red wine mist has cleared, I guess?

I did see the game last night, even though it was on a quality streem, and I did not see that Wisdom was on his knees after 90 mins.

I was waiting for a forward sub, as Grabban was starting to fade, and Jerome/Lafferty was more likely than a RB sub, but it was not to be.

Whittaker played well, so can''t complain about his 30 mins, but still, AN must have decided a penalty shootout was a 50% (at best) chance, while winning it in extra time was less likely, so therefore a defender for a defender instead of an attcker for an attacker...

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What I liked from the game was that Mulumbu and VOO showed they got big roles to play, even O''Neil.

Ryan Bennett played very well, and he should be in strong contention for more playing time in the next games.

Rudd was very good, and showed, on this performance, he is on equal footing to Ruddy (when Ruddy is a bit off form, as he seems to be in recent weeks).

All-in-all, lots of positives, despite a rather unlucky end to the game with the penalties.

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[quote user="grefstad"][quote user="hogesar"]Try watching or at least following a game every now and then Grefstad, then you''d realise Wisdom was both shattered and seemed to be carrying a knock. Then your naturally negative post wouldn''t have been required.[/quote]

Well. Hog, awake after the red wine mist has cleared, I guess?

I did see the game last night, even though it was on a quality streem, and I did not see that Wisdom was on his knees after 90 mins.

I was waiting for a forward sub, as Grabban was starting to fade, and Jerome/Lafferty was more likely than a RB sub, but it was not to be.

Whittaker played well, so can''t complain about his 30 mins, but still, AN must have decided a penalty shootout was a 50% (at best) chance, while winning it in extra time was less likely, so therefore a defender for a defender instead of an attcker for an attacker...[/quote]Why do you feel the need to insult someone that has just pointed out that you are wrong?

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So tvis Hog fellow was not insulting me, accusing me of not watching games? I have guaranteed seen mote football than Hog will ever do, so I dont need to be belittled by him in any way.

As for me being wrong, was I?

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[quote user="grefstad"]So tvis Hog fellow was not insulting me, accusing me of not watching games? I have guaranteed seen mote football than Hog will ever do, so I dont need to be belittled by him in any way.

As for me being wrong, was I?[/quote]Well, yes. Yes you were.Its a reasonable accusation when someone puts forward an opinion that appears to lack any substance.How exactly can you guarantee that you have seen more football than Hog will ever do? That is a stupid statement really, isn'' it?By making stupid statements and unfounded ones people will assume you are a bit of a tit.I hope this helps you in life.

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1) I don''t drink red wine, well not since an eventful Xmas party.

2) I wasn''t insulting, just indicating that if you saw the game you wouldn''t have posted a criticism of that substitution.

3) I''m 23. So you''ve probably seen more football than me. I reckon I''ve got at least another 30 years or so in me though.

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Good to see there is one less red wine drinker in the forum....

As for me having seen more footie than most, yes, that is a statement I don''t intend to withdraw.

Regarding criticism of substitutions, this is always a matter of opinion. Some see it one way, some see it another way. It is the charm of football, and the charm of football discussions.

I do think we would have had a decent chance to win the Everton game in extra time with an attacking substitution, but it would ofcourse be dependant on how injured/knackered Wisdom was at the time.

Everton were not overly dangerous going forward, no more than us anyway, so an attacking sub would make sense, if there were no other more precarious reasons to adress elsewhere.

Obviously the coaching staff knows better than both you and me, but for me, I did not see Wisdom being totally exhausted or injured, although I did not particularly look for it either.

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We made an attacking substitution v Newcastle - that went well.

In many ways, Whitaker is an attacking defender.

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[quote user="grefstad"]Good to see there is one less red wine drinker in the forum....

As for me having seen more footie than most, yes, that is a statement I don''t intend to withdraw.

Regarding criticism of substitutions, this is always a matter of opinion. Some see it one way, some see it another way. It is the charm of football, and the charm of football discussions.

I do think we would have had a decent chance to win the Everton game in extra time with an attacking substitution, but it would ofcourse be dependant on how injured/knackered Wisdom was at the time.

Everton were not overly dangerous going forward, no more than us anyway, so an attacking sub would make sense, if there were no other more precarious reasons to adress elsewhere.

Obviously the coaching staff knows better than both you and me, but for me, I did not see Wisdom being totally exhausted or injured, although I did not particularly look for it either.[/quote]But Wisdom was injured, Alex Neil said so. Jeez, just admit you got it wrong, instead of arrogantly trying to style out of it.

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[quote user="grefstad"]

I do think we would have had a decent chance to win the Everton game in extra time with an attacking substitution, but it would ofcourse be dependant on how injured/knackered Wisdom was at the time.[/quote]Did you see the post saying Neil had confirmed Wisdom was withdrawn due to injury and he wanted to make a more offensive substitution? If he had replaced Grabban after 80 minutes and then Wisdom got injured, we''d have been playing with 10 men. It''s a no-win situation really, when you have to be mindful of the fact there is likely to be an extra 30 minutes to factor in. It was just an unfortunate set of circumstances rather than a tactical misjudgement IMO.

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