Parma's Tactics Masterclass 9

[Parma Ham's gone mouldy 2,219]

Agreed YS72. I said the same on the Leicester game thread, with Mbokani likely to replace Jerome. I included a little thinking on why too.

Parma

[Parma Ham's gone mouldy 2,219]

Purple,

As usual you touch on rather fundamental points, which gives me an opportunity to reiterate some principles.

Whilst there are few strikers that have a developed sense of defensive responsibilities, this is it to say that coaches wouldn''t develop, create or utilise players capable of this if our libero became prevalent, influential and effective.

As we have discussed many times "we play our own game...we don''t worry about the opposition" is largely rubbish, untrue and for the cameras. You don''t want your own players fearful of the opposition, but as a manager you select players with natural overriding tendencies that negate opposition strengths (even possibly without the player themselves knowing why or how they do it).

The Hughton might be characterised as trying to educate and coach players to perform these roles, the Alex Neil way might be identified as picking players that naturally play a certain way and deploying them to achieve the result for the team (by doing what they instinctively do anyway). This is why better results can be achieved with lesser individual players - this is commonly observed at international level where certain sides "overachieve" via clarity of methodology and players clearly knowing their roles (and performing them naturally), such as Croatia, Serbia, Belgium..

As for where our goals are designed to come from, there are clear partners that we can observe. The 9 is a pivot who drops deeper to overload the high midfield area, whilst also running extensively into wider areas, constantly moving the defensive line around. This is designed to open pockets of space in between-the-lines and three quarter areas.

This space is penetrated by high, tucked in wide-of-three forward players (typically Jarvis, Brady, Redmond), who are tasked with running beyond the pivot from outish-to-in and certainly between full back and centre back. These area the spaces we are trying to create and it is crucial that there is pace and regular, driving runs into these areas going past the 9, whether the ball is received or not.

These runs are harder to mark, create a clear, deeper pocket of space for Wes - who is not a 10 in the classic sense and not a player who typically greats entire box and certainly not one for running in behind. Yet this organisation makes the most of the natural instincts and way of playing of the players we have, both moving the chance of tactical success in our favour and also -crucially-''making it much more likely that such "instructions"''will hold up under pressure and in stressful situations, as it is the players'' default characteristics anyway.

Parma

[Parma Ham's gone mouldy 2,219]

VW,

Norwich use a combination of Zonal, man-to-man and trading two men on the posts for extra bodies in the box and pace kept high up the field for counters.

I am not against any of this, there are perfectly good reasons to use any of the above and plenty of sense in combining elements of all of them. It is very long and dry to explain, players will tell you they can spend much of their week working on it - and mostly standing around, which they hate...With lots of repetition, which they often switch off from. Over a couple of beers we could go through it!

It must also be acknowledged that there are angles, flights of delivery, shapes of balls in at certain speeds that are just difficult to defend. A player that can deliver such shapes of ball regularly is worth 5 goals a season at this level at least and there is not always a lot you can do (sorry if that sounds passive).

As a coach you focus on controllable elements, which is why I identified the timing and location of "tactical fouls", which good Italians can smell the moment for. Don''t underestimate the importance and effectiveness of this skill and getting it right.

Further controllable factors include focus on Ruddy''s role and what constitutes his responsibility. Polishing his mindset and working on his mental and strategic influence over his defenders, the team and the culture, tempo and approach to games. As Giggs famously said defending Roy Keane to journalists "what you don''t see is that he makes every other player on the field play 10% better just by being there". Goalkeepers can - and Ruddy could - do this too.

Man-to-man is simpler to execute and understand for simpler footballers. Zonal marking is good in principle, better perhaps, but in my experience has too many variables and insecurities for British-educated players (sorry again). Men on the posts save "certain goals"''as pundits see it, but this too is simplistic and flawed.

One of my key aims as a coach is to get no praise. This may sound oxymoronic, but I cherish the bad things that didn''t happen, that nobody saw, that I planned for som meticulously that they didn''t happen and thus nobody gave me credit for.......

Avoiding the free kicks in the wrong areas is far more controllable than hoping a Gerrard doesn''t execute the right shape on a free kick....

Parma

[Parma Ham's gone mouldy 2,219]

I should have added that by identifying things that didn''t happen, Inwas referring to what ELSE the two men on the posts might stop happening by being deployed somewhere else.

This is where the 20/20 hindsight of pundits - and sometimes fans - is flawed. They don''t see all the things that didn''t happen (when the players not on the posts won headers, blocked runs, put strikers off and nothing of note then occurred).

Parma

[Yelloow Since 72 54]

I''ve had a look at the Leicester thread, Parma and agree with your reasons for starting Mbokani and your line-up as well (the 11 man version anyway). My main doubt about Mbokani is whether he has the match fitness to start. I know he started in the cup, but the dynamics of that game were different.

[Parma Ham's gone mouldy 2,219]

Purple,

Not quite like-for-like fair, but as one who likes stats, we can observe the fluidity of Martin playing more as a midfielder and Tettey as more of a defender..... = Martin 3 goals, Tettey 0 goals....

Slightly flawed, but we can certainly say in our new libero-minded approach that a key principle for non-pivot, more fluid players could be :

"Don''t finish where you start and don''t start where you (want to) finish"

This is hard to mark and for the opposition to make plans for without having equally fluid players and tactics.

The one who is perhaps a little restricted vis-a-via natural role and instincts is Howson, who typically plays the "regista" role floating around and in front of Tettey. With Wes in front in a buzzing, probing central but in-to-out role, Howson is tasked with reading the game more than others and adjusting his role, shape and positioning to suit events. A great compliment to him. Though likely to lead to more circumspection and less goals from him personally (unless Dorrans is on the team sheet too, offsetting some of this responsibility).

Parma

[PurpleCanary 5,554]

[quote user="Parma Hams gone mouldy"]Purple,

As usual you touch on rather fundamental points, which gives me an opportunity to reiterate some principles.

Whilst there are few strikers that have a developed sense of defensive responsibilities, this is it to say that coaches wouldn''t develop, create or utilise players capable of this if our libero became prevalent, influential and effective.

As we have discussed many times "we play our own game...we don''t worry about the opposition" is largely rubbish, untrue and for the cameras. You don''t want your own players fearful of the opposition, but as a manager you select players with natural overriding tendencies that negate opposition strengths (even possibly without the player themselves knowing why or how they do it).

The Hughton might be characterised as trying to educate and coach players to perform these roles, the Alex Neil way might be identified as picking players that naturally play a certain way and deploying them to achieve the result for the team (by doing what they instinctively do anyway). This is why better results can be achieved with lesser individual players - this is commonly observed at international level where certain sides "overachieve" via clarity of methodology and players clearly knowing their roles (and performing them naturally), such as Croatia, Serbia, Belgium..

As for where our goals are designed to come from, there are clear partners that we can observe. The 9 is a pivot who drops deeper to overload the high midfield area, whilst also running extensively into wider areas, constantly moving the defensive line around. This is designed to open pockets of space in between-the-lines and three quarter areas.

This space is penetrated by high, tucked in wide-of-three forward players (typically Jarvis, Brady, Redmond), who are tasked with running beyond the pivot from outish-to-in and certainly between full back and centre back. These area the spaces we are trying to create and it is crucial that there is pace and regular, driving runs into these areas going past the 9, whether the ball is received or not.

These runs are harder to mark, create a clear, deeper pocket of space for Wes - who is not a 10 in the classic sense and not a player who typically greats entire box and certainly not one for running in behind. Yet this organisation makes the most of the natural instincts and way of playing of the players we have, both moving the chance of tactical success in our favour and also -crucially-''making it much more likely that such "instructions"''will hold up under pressure and in stressful situations, as it is the players'' default characteristics anyway.

Parma[/quote]Parma, thanks for the replies. The more ones reads the more it looks as if there was a very clear tactical policy behind the summer transfers. Another - and possibly better - No. 9 pivot in Mbokani, and two more players - Brady and Jarvis - able to utilise these spaces created.

[Yelloow Since 72 54]

Not only the transfers Purple, but our tactics seem much clearer now. I found it curious that Mbokani on several occasions failed to follow attacks into the penalty area but that could be because he''s playing the deeper pivot role Parma is describing. Brady and Jarvis and or Redmond thus become our most attacking players as they come inside.

[Parma Ham's gone mouldy 2,219]

Correct Purple and moreover your principle I think explains why a centre back was not purchased.

Fitting the tactical template requires a better defender than Martin OF THE SAME KIND (not just a better defender).

Given that defenders who comfortably move into full back, three quarter and midfield areas naturally, plus an instinct to sense danger later, plus an ability to move and slide passes regularly and crisply into midfield are reasonably rare in British football, plus expensive with typically high wages regardless of where they are from, we are talking about prized commodities that we couldn''t afford or ultimately attract this summer. Alex Neil wants better or nothing, plus they must fit the tactical template. Good management.

Parma

[Parma Ham's gone mouldy 2,219]

Agreed up to a point YS72.

My caveat would be that I would be surprised if striking coaches and manager were not working closely with Mbokani this week, encouraging him to drive into the box more having done good work outside the area.

To some degree this is having it all, but Mbokani is not designed to be only false in my view and increased fitness, match sharpness and coaching will see greater efforts to get on the end of things in the box.

I will admit to a slight concern that - as a striker - he sometimes doesn''t kill himself to do this (match fit or otherwise). This striking hunger is not always coachable.

I think this, plus a reticence to use his left foot, explains why he wasn''t already a premier league player. He is a handful though, difficult to get the ball off, difficult to mark tightly, powerful, with a very strong and deft right foot, hard working, a very strong and decisive runner, surprisingly good awareness and vision for a 9 and signs of quite a creative mind.

If Neil can coach, encourage, drill, uncover the former - which I''m sure he believes he can - then we have a very useful weapon that fits the template very nicely.

Parma

[ron obvious 1,501]

Parma, this all makes so much sense as regards the style & quality of performances we''ve seen this season. It''s like you have inside knowledge??!!

Seriously, it''s obvious that you can analyse the game at a different level to anyone else on here, & it''s obvious that Neil has the same ability. Which is fascinating, because, let''s be honest, he has the demeanour of a man more suited to the challenges of a drunken fist fight on Sauchiehall Street (which can be a managerial asset in itself) than the intellectual ramifications of false no. 9s & zonal v. man marking etc.

It now makes perfect sense why he prefers Grabban to Hooper & Lafferty. I also think Mbokani has the necessary nous to play the Neil way, judging by his lovely pass to Jarvis in the West Brom match.

I personally welcome the addition of some intelligence to the old blood-&-guts approach of traditional football. Neil is giving us the best of both worlds.

Anyway, Parma, should a managerial vacancy ever become available at Carrow Road .....??

[Bannana Boy 30]

Thanks again for some great posts Parma - I don''t want to be too gushing, but your posts are always an entertaining and informative read.

I''ve a couple of questions, and would welcome your thoughts.

1) Are we one-dimensional? By that I mean do we have the one strategic approach (which you have previously analysed) and if this is effectively countered, we are done for? The old ''no plan B'' argument.

2) The million-dollar question - how would you counter NCFC?

Thanks again for the posts Parma

[Yelloow Since 72 54]

Thanks Parma. I also think Mbokani is ideally suited to ''driving into the box'' and hope to see him doing it soon.

As for the one-dimensional threat, Binslayer, I think the fluidity prevents that from happening if I understand Parma correctly. The ''Plan'' is fluid with no A. B or C. The object is to move and confuse to create spaces that can be exploited. There is no set pattern and players respond intuitively to the opportunities created. It really is clever stuff.

It also doesn''t rule out a more conventional fast breaking counter-attack when the opportunity occurs, with other players reorganising behind the break in case the ball is lost.

I look forward to Parma''s answer to your question 2, Binslayer.

[Bannana Boy 30]

@Yelloow - I tend to agree (that''s how I read and interpreted Parma''s analysis).

What I was thinking (if I understood Parma correctly, of course) was that the fluidity relies on a few key principles, and if these are successfully nullified, or a majority of them nullified at least, then the whole house of cards could come falling down.

And yes, very much looking forward to Parma''s answer to Q2 also.

[Jacko 0]

The answer to question 2 is quite simple - call for Simon Hooper

[westcoastcanary 0]

Parma''s spotlight has focussed primarily on our play when in possession (apart from his points about where not to make tactical fouls, set piece strategies and the potential / need for Ruddy to metamorphose into a more assertive, decisive and game-intelligent keeper). He''s pointed out how overloading the space higher up the field not only increases our chance of retaining possession, but occupies potential opposition attackers. Reducing the chances of breakdown is fine, but it is for sure going to happen, and though I haven''t worked systematically through our goals conceded my impression is that we are not as good as we might be in anticipating and countering turnovers. It''s a fine balance, and our GD of -1 suggests we''re not far from getting it right; but I''d feel more comfortable if GD stayed even just marginally in positive territory.

[Parma Ham's gone mouldy 2,219]

Excellent questions L14.

1. The answer to the one dimensional question is quite straightforward and almost binary. Our German-style fluid, disciplined, clear-role style is repeatable, modern and effective.

To be better than us, teams will have to be better than us and use their players more effectively or - most commonly - have players that can do something special against the flow and the odds. You simply have to shake the guys hand at this.

As for one dimensional and the binary point, we have an excellent alternative to our fluid, yet structured play. We don''t do it.

This is not flippant. We shut the spaces, take up good defensive positions (Why Nathan won''t play every week) and concede possession and (some) territory. This can be seen in the (sort of) paradox between what we see with our eyes and what the possession stats and running stats say. We dominate and control the ball, until we don''t need to. We press and squeeze in certain areas and situations as a joined-up unit, or we don''t (This we all do it or none of us do it also helps reinforce the-team-as-bigger-than-the-individual message).

If you want "weaknesses" These strategies allow for the opposition to be better - if they are.

It allows for brilliant opposition players to do brilliant things - if they can.

As a coach - and certainly in Norwich''s level - I fully agree with this approach. Give them nothing cheap tactically, but pat them on the back for brilliance or being better than you, there''s no shame in this.

2. L14 if we are ever in the pub together and having a few beers, I will gladly spend hours analysing and debating this. I am afraid that I am not going to do it here on a public forum.

I am good at what I do and I just cannot freely do something that could hurt Norwich City.

Parma

[Bannana Boy 30]

Thanks for the reply Parma - interesting and informative as always.

If we''re ever in the pub, I''ll happily get the beers in!

[Yelloow Since 72 54]

It strikes me that the brillance of these tactics is the focus they give to teamwork and synergy, where the performance of the whole team is more than just the sum of its parts. The top teams will always have more technically gifted players who cost more because of that. Germany has both, which is why they have such a consistent record internationally. Other PL teams like ourselves have to find a way to bridge that gap or end up struggling for survival. These tactics seem to provide that as the season so far has shown.

Players still have freedom to move and express themselves doing what comes naturally and it makes for very good ''entertainment'' as well, as AN himself has emphasised and they must enjoy playing this way rather than following a more rigidly structured tactical system, as under Hughton. I''m really looking forward to the Leicester game now to watch this in action. Thanks again, Parma.

[lake district canary 4,531]

I like these threads too.  I do wonder how the way AN sets up his teams compares to the way Brian Clough used to play.  Clough got good players in, but on a smaller budget than the big boys - and did incredibly well.  That is something I would love to see happen again - and it would be great if it was our club.  The discipline in the team play was there with Clough, as it is with AN - but Clough also had that happy knack of getting the players to perform at their best nearly all the time - again, as AN does.  So is our disciplined but fluid way of playing going to take us to the top?  Who knows, it may be a step too far, but at it looks as if it will be fun watching this season and seeing how far we can go.

[Yelloow Since 72 54]

That''s not a bad comparison, LDC, though the personalities are very different. You could also consider how Mike Walker managed to ram-raid the hierarchy in the early 90s. I''m suspecting that we''ve only seen the beginning of what AN and this squad can achieve.