Football matches an easy target?

[nutty nigel 7,513]

[quote user="Indy"][quote user="nutty nigel"][quote user="Indy"][quote

user="nutty nigel"][quote user="Indy"]No we''re debating stop believing the world

revolves round this board.......in the real life we are preached to on a daily

bases, through news events ain''t gay demonstrations, Islam demos and so on......

We''re debating religion and its impact and asking based on no evidence why do so

many feel the need to cause harm in the name of religion?[/quote]

 

The debating must be starting here then Indy. So if that''s a sign that your

preaching has ended then I love a good debate.... The best answer I can give to

your question is to say its what people are like. At the same time there is far

far more goodness and kindness done in the name of religion because again that''s

what people are like. And thankfully there''s far more good and kind people than

there is evil. Interesting that you mention the news. There are far more good

things that happen every day. But they are not news because they are

commonplace. The power of the media is such that afterhalf an hours news the

opposite appears the case. Now what do you think the reason is?[/quote]

Why derail the thread Nutty, where''s your proof for an almighty God? Just one

shred of evidence,one miracle? Where is any of the mythical challis, ark or any

other artefact? And intrsting that the only real documentation to a Jesus 2000

years ago was a warrior fighting the Romans in Syria! There''s not one shred, not

one and the only ever response is we have to prove there isn''t! How can you

prove a myth? Like previously said you must believe in pixies, elves and Santa!

Based on your argument. 😃[/quote]

Indy, I took up the offer of debate in good faith. I answered your question

to the best of my limited ability. But its not debate you''re after. Is

it?[/quote]

 

No you answered with questions, very well deflected almost Tory like! But

that''s about what expected. Not all people are evil, but most religious fanatics

are brainwashed so are weak minded. Here is where I stop, I have religious

parents, RC and had to put up with following my parents religion till I was old

enough and allowed to make my own mind up by my parents. I have this debate with

them now and then and we never come to an agreement because there is no

argument, there is no physical God but only faith in each persons own

mind.....[/quote]

 

I don''t recognise that description in my answer Indy.  

[Gainer the Gopher 0]

There are other religions besides Christianity. However, to claim Jj66 ess didn''t exist is odd. His life is documented far more than perhaps anything else from antiquity. Do you not believe Athenians a democracy or the Persians creating the first postal service? If you do, what do you base it on?

[Buh 0]

Where''s the evidence he existed? And if he did do you believe he turned water to wine? Walked on water? Healed the sick? Was resurrected? The core values of CHRISTianity are these magic tricks and they never happened. All just key jangling for the weak Minded masses

[Herman 9,717]

There''s thousands of fucking paintings of him. What more evidence do you want?

[Buh 0]

Yeah white dude with a beard. Likely in the Middle East eh?

Do you think if we keep drawing batman he''ll perform miracles as well?

[Katie Borkins 1]

Sorry, Buh.

It is clear to anyone with half a mind that he was put into a Virgin''s belly, born in a manger in a stable in Bethlehem, and was a carpenter until his true calling was announced to him at which point he walked on water, turned water into wine, threw out the moneylenders from the temple, healed the sick and lame with the touch of his hand, and after being executed he was resurrected because his real Dad thought he needed to show the rest of us how much he cared.

If you don''t get that, then we can''t be friends.

[Indy 3,286]

Yoda uses the force for good! He can use move huge objects and control weak minded people.....now that must be as believable as any religion? Jedi.

[Katie Borkins 1]

Oh, for what it''s worth:

I''m sure he did exist.  I think he was born around the Bethlehem area about nine months after his parents had sex, I think he was probably a carpenter for a while after his father, and he was probably quite a compassionate and caring dude who asked people to respect each other and treat each other as they themselves would like to be treated.  Which, after all, isn''t a bad principle with which to live your life by.  He was probably executed for reasons known only to the ruling empire.

I think time has probably inflated his achievements slightly.

A bit like Grant Holt''s last season at Norwich.

[nutty nigel 7,513]

But was he weak minded ...

[JF 694]

Jesus > Dinamo. Magician impossible!

[PurpleCanary 5,554]

[quote user="Gainer the Gopher"]I think this qualifies the most bizarre post I have seen on this site. And I have seen a few contenders. - Purple

What is so bizarre about it? People hear voices in their head, kill, then blame God or an angel. It''s rare, so it''s news.

Til, the Klan barely exist at all, and what few murders they''ve been involved in were against their own or their former own. Nothing to do with religion or insanity.

The vast majority of murders are committed by someone the victim knows, which is why mass killings in the name of faith like 7/7 and 9/11 are so very unusual.

We read about an unusual death caused by neglect or hate or whatever and wonder what is the world coming to. But the truth is the world, or our part of it at the very least, is safer, better fed, more comfortable, healthier, and wealthier than ever.[/quote]We are slightly at cross-purposes. You are right that ther vast majority of individual murders are personal in nature, but I was referring more to the numbers of deaths involved, and in any event your idea that religious-insired mass killings are rare in not really true. Off the top of my head the following mass killings certainly were motivated at least in part by religion:In the Middle Ages the massacres in France of religious minorities such as the Cathars, and later on the St Bartholomew''s Day Massacre by the Catholic majority of Protestants.The vast ethnic cleansing (a euphemism for murder) of Armenian Christians by the Muslim Ottoman Empire.The murderous Hindu versus Muslim struggle around the time of Indian independence.Th ethnic cleansing in Sri Lanka of Muslims.The ethnic cleansing - such as the Srebrenica massacre in which 8,000 died - of Bosnian Muslims.Any number of anti-Jewish pogroms.The Islamist murders such as 9/11 with which we are all familiar.I have it at the back of my mind that you are a history teachers?

[Mr Apples 1,317]

Not been on-line today, who''s winning the debate?!?!?!? [:D]

 

(ps...I''m still currently inherently evil...well until 3.30 on Friday at least [;)])

 

Apples 

[Katie Borkins 1]

[quote user="PurpleCanary"][quote user="Gainer the Gopher"]I think this qualifies the most bizarre post I have seen on this site. And I have seen a few contenders. - Purple

What is so bizarre about it? People hear voices in their head, kill, then blame God or an angel. It''s rare, so it''s news.

Til, the Klan barely exist at all, and what few murders they''ve been involved in were against their own or their former own. Nothing to do with religion or insanity.

The vast majority of murders are committed by someone the victim knows, which is why mass killings in the name of faith like 7/7 and 9/11 are so very unusual.

We read about an unusual death caused by neglect or hate or whatever and wonder what is the world coming to. But the truth is the world, or our part of it at the very least, is safer, better fed, more comfortable, healthier, and wealthier than ever.[/quote]We are slightly at cross-purposes. You are right that ther vast majority of individual murders are personal in nature, but I was referring more to the numbers of deaths involved, and in any event your idea that religious-insired mass killings are rare in not really true. Off the top of my head the following mass killings certainly were motivated at least in part by religion:In the Middle Ages the massacres in France of religious minorities such as the Cathars, and later on the St Bartholomew''s Day Massacre by the Catholic majority of Protestants.The vast ethnic cleansing (a euphemism for murder) of Armenian Christians by the Muslim Ottoman Empire.The murderous Hindu versus Muslim struggle around the time of Indian independence.Th ethnic cleansing in Sri Lanka of Muslims.The ethnic cleansing - such as the Srebrenica massacre in which 8,000 died - of Bosnian Muslims.Any number of anti-Jewish pogroms.The Islamist murders such as 9/11 with which we are all familiar.I have it at the back of my mind that you are a history teachers?[/quote]

You could also throw in the persecution of the Kurds by successive Iraqi regimes, and the Sunni Muslim/Shia Muslim ongoing conflict which is apparently two factions of the same religion being unable to accept or tolerate each other.

[nutty nigel 7,513]

Not sure anyone can win Apples. But it will soon be the weekend...

 

I''m going to spend the rest of my evening trying to work out if one colony of ants cares if another colony is wiped out by my neighbours boiled kettle. And whether it would make any difference if they were weak minded....

 

 

[PurpleCanary 5,554]

[quote user="Bor Bor Bor"][quote user="PurpleCanary"][quote user="Gainer the Gopher"]I think this qualifies the most bizarre post I have seen on this site. And I have seen a few contenders. - Purple

What is so bizarre about it? People hear voices in their head, kill, then blame God or an angel. It''s rare, so it''s news.

Til, the Klan barely exist at all, and what few murders they''ve been involved in were against their own or their former own. Nothing to do with religion or insanity.

The vast majority of murders are committed by someone the victim knows, which is why mass killings in the name of faith like 7/7 and 9/11 are so very unusual.

We read about an unusual death caused by neglect or hate or whatever and wonder what is the world coming to. But the truth is the world, or our part of it at the very least, is safer, better fed, more comfortable, healthier, and wealthier than ever.[/quote]We are slightly at cross-purposes. You are right that ther vast majority of individual murders are personal in nature, but I was referring more to the numbers of deaths involved, and in any event your idea that religious-insired mass killings are rare in not really true. Off the top of my head the following mass killings certainly were motivated at least in part by religion:In the Middle Ages the massacres in France of religious minorities such as the Cathars, and later on the St Bartholomew''s Day Massacre by the Catholic majority of Protestants.The vast ethnic cleansing (a euphemism for murder) of Armenian Christians by the Muslim Ottoman Empire.The murderous Hindu versus Muslim struggle around the time of Indian independence.Th ethnic cleansing in Sri Lanka of Muslims.The ethnic cleansing - such as the Srebrenica massacre in which 8,000 died - of Bosnian Muslims.Any number of anti-Jewish pogroms.The Islamist murders such as 9/11 with which we are all familiar.I have it at the back of my mind that you are a history teachers?[/quote]

You could also throw in the persecution of the Kurds by successive Iraqi regimes, and the Sunni Muslim/Shia Muslim ongoing conflict which is apparently two factions of the same religion being unable to accept or tolerate each other.

[/quote]Indeed. Thanks.

[Mr Apples 1,317]

Ahhhhhh, come the weekend I can hang up my evil outfit and become a regular member of society...until 8.30 on Monday when I don my villian''s outfit and once more return to the horrors (rationality) of modern science. [:D]

 

That''s a very zen question...does an ant have the emotional ability to care and if it does, could it care less (thereby answering the question of it''s strength of mind)??? [;)]

 

Apples  

[lake district canary 4,531]

[quote user="Bor Bor Bor"]

Oh, for what it''s worth:

I''m sure he did exist.  I think he was born around the Bethlehem area about nine months after his parents had sex, I think he was probably a carpenter for a while after his father, and he was probably quite a compassionate and caring dude who asked people to respect each other and treat each other as they themselves would like to be treated.  Which, after all, isn''t a bad principle with which to live your life by.  He was probably executed for reasons known only to the ruling empire.

I think time has probably inflated his achievements slightly.

A bit like Grant Holt''s last season at Norwich.

[/quote]

There may be some truth in his existence, probably an inspirational

teacher schooled in buddhism - the deification of him though, was

probably more allegorical and to do with the traditions of the time.  Jesus''s message is and was a profound one, extolling

virtues very similar to buddhism - showing love for all living beings,

compassion and helping others and giving, without expecting anything in

return.   The message is there and shines through all the allegory and

Biblespeak - its a message that people can understand - which maybe

accounts for the success of Christianity - they just can''t quite get

their heads around all the other stuff.   Holty is a different story.....inspirational throughout his four years at Norwich as shown by the team''s success in those four years and in his being top scorer for four years [;)] . 

[R Mellie 0]

My own position for what it''s worth is one of complete and utter disbelief in all things religious/God. That said, I would not dream of telling anybody what they should or shouldn''t believe in, and I respect their right to do so. On the flip side, I also tend to think that a little more critical thinking would do the world of good ((to the world)...

There are a number of ''mainstream'' religions, they can''t all be right can they? For my money, the theory of evolution is the one that underpins our existence - personally, I don''t hold any truck with the notion that there must be a higher purpose for our being here - is it so unthinkable that there must have been a creator?

Good to read different viewpoints though, even if, due to a lack of empirical evidence in my opinion, I believe them to be incorrect.

[R Mellie 0]

Oh for an edit button - I did of course mean *is it so unthinkable that there could not have been a creator*

Doh...

[Gainer the Gopher 0]

It is clear to anyone with half a mind that he was put into a Virgin''s belly, born in a manger in a stable in Bethlehem, and was a carpenter until his true calling was announced to him at which point he walked on water, turned water into wine, threw out the moneylenders from the temple, healed the sick and lame with the touch of his hand, and after being executed he was resurrected because his real Dad thought he needed to ........ - Bornobor

You think Mexico and Texas are pretty much the same.

[Faded Jaded Semi Plastic SOB 1,020]

In response to the original post, I think that a football match would be an easy target, as would somewhere like a shopping mall, anywhere there is a large gathering of people and minimal security. The security services have to be lucky all of the time, terrorists only have to be lucky once......

On the meaning of life, the universe and everything, the answer is 42, we just do not know what the question is.......

Do I believe in immaculate conception, no I do not, do I believe that we all sprung from Adam (and Eve who was made out of a rib), no I do not particularly as both their offspring were male, do I believe there is a God... on that one I have no answer as there is nothing to prove/disprove it either way.

I have no issue with people that have a particular faith system, way of life etc, I identify with the Buddhist faith but I know I will never really achieve inner peace whilst I am behind the wheel of a car......

[Katie Borkins 1]

"You think Mexico and Texas are pretty much the same."

They have similarities. For a start, and as you demonstrate so beautifully, both have an apparent "open door" policy to a$$holes.

[Miss Bum Bum 0]

As I have said many a time those looking for inner peace need only join me in worshipping in the Church of Paul Lambert.

It''s a great place to be

[hogesar 9,618]

[quote user="Gainer the Gopher"]Maybe change your logo before spewing such hypocrisy.

Should other nationalities be banned?[/quote]

Touche [:D]

[Katie Borkins 1]

Appalling scenes in Paris last night. Off the scale.

[lake district canary 4,531]

[quote user="Bor"]Appalling scenes in Paris last night. Off the scale.[/quote]Reminds everyone of  the levels human beings can descend to. Humans can be incredibly loving, creative and capable of huge kindness, but when damaged in some way are also capable of the total opposite.  Last night was just another example.   Pointless destructivenes and lack of humanity which will achieve nothing except in the heads of those who think it''s somehow all to do with some great cause.  Aiming their violent hatred at people out enjoying themselves is based on an agenda of  vileness that will never achieve anything.  Terrible as it is, history shows us that evil cannot win in the long run. So it will be with this kind of terrorism.  Humanity will always prevail - eventually.

[im spartacus canary 0]

Won''t stop the likes of benedict cumberbatch and Emma Thompson pontificating to the rest of us about letting in every unidentifiable nutter who wants to blow us up. Maybe if the barbican was hit during a performance of hamlet ?

[ricardo 7,349]

[quote user="im spartacus"]Won''t stop the likes of benedict cumberbatch and Emma Thompson pontificating to the rest of us about letting in every unidentifiable nutter who wants to blow us up. Maybe if the barbican was hit during a performance of hamlet ?[/quote]I wouldn''t joke about it, an attack in London or another British city is well nigh inevitable.Some people believe that we can negotiate with these people and come to an amicable accommodation.we can''t.

[Herman 9,717]

[quote user="ricardo"][quote user="im spartacus"]Won''t stop the likes of benedict cumberbatch and Emma Thompson pontificating to the rest of us about letting in every unidentifiable nutter who wants to blow us up. Maybe if the barbican was hit during a performance of hamlet ?[/quote]I wouldn''t joke about it, an attack in London or another British city is well nigh inevitable.Some people believe that we can negotiate with these people and come to an amicable accommodation.we can''t.[/quote]I don''t think anyone believes that we can negotiate with IS.

[AJ 1,218]

I''ve got to say I''m surprised sporting events haven''t been targeted more and perhaps we''ve been quite lucky in that respect. The Premier League is obviously a global thing, as is F1 at Silverstone and Tennis at Wimbledon etc. Obviously with the Olympics being hosted here in 2012 security was very good, as I''m sure it will be in France for the Euro''s.

Last nights actions, however, show that even in the safety zone of Western Europe we still have to be so vigilant and that not every act can be detected and stopped. The scenes of the concert venue are harrowing, and this is obviously a strike right into the heart of Europe. Despite the explosions heard around the ground they kept playing which I was a bit surprised about. Can''t even begin to imagine being in a situation like that either as a player or a fan. Utterly harrowing.