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hazza9

A few players who should be looked at.

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Pritchard & Bamford even on loan would be very good, both showed a class above in the Championship.

Hutu would be a solid signing and last Grey from Brum would just be exceptional signing!

Then a left/right back and job done as we have a solid squad already.

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We seem to have done the UK market - any view from beyond this fair isle?Purely a starter for 10.  ThoughtsLoic Perrin           CB  St Etienne             Eric Botteghin      CB, GroningenSteven Berghuis   AM AZ Alkmaar  Micheal Kramer    FW Den Haag

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Sky reporting that Championship and Premiership clubs are looking at Dwight Gayle, but Palace''s valuation is putting clubs off, wonder if one is us. I believe they payed around the same as we did for RVW during the same transfer window too, remember thinking at the time we had the much better player for the money! A player I''d be very pleased with now though.

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We''ve also been linked with John Guidetti (Pink Un homepage), but if we''re going for a Manchester City striker, I''d prefer bringing Kelechi Iheanacho in on loan.

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Just wonder with the changes at Watford and another new manager, if we should not try for Troy Deeney ? may be unsettled and would give us a real strong strikeforce?

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Berbatov may be on a free you can bet all the tea in china he will want a 4-5 million signing on fee

I do wonder about some of the names on peoples lists as they appear to be experts on lower league continental teams and players

or is it all mouse based stats from fm

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[quote user="mrs miggins"]Roberto Firmino apparently going to Man U for £13m[/quote]Shame we didn''t sign him 2 years ago when I initially suggested it...

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[quote user="Indy_Bones"][quote user="mrs miggins"]Roberto Firmino apparently going to Man U for £13m[/quote]Shame we didn''t sign him 2 years ago when I initially suggested it...[/quote]Wow, you''re such a football visionary[;)]

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[quote user="morty"]Wow, you''re such a football visionary[;)][/quote]I appreciate the compliment Morty [;)]Joking aside, I have made a number of suggestions over the years about potential signings who I thought would be excellent for us, and have been routinely ridiculed or had them dismissed as ''foreign no-marks'' in many cases - only for a reasonable % of them to end up at a much bigger club a year or two later...I appreciate that occasionally I can overreach with some suggestions (did I really suggest Isco just before Madrid signed him!), but surely it''s better to offer insight into players who may not be as well known over here, but have a very good potential, rather than echoing the usual suspects that 90% of our fanbase seem unable to look past (I think Mackail-Smith HAS to be coming round again shortly [;)]).

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[quote user="Indy_Bones"]Joking aside, I have made a number of suggestions over the years about potential signings who I thought would be excellent for us, and have been routinely ridiculed or had them dismissed as ''foreign no-marks'' in many cases - only for a reasonable % of them to end up at a much bigger club a year or two later...[/quote]If we had signed Firmino in the summer of 2013, would he have scored 16 league goals as he did in Germany? Just because a player is successful in one country (Di Maria, Bale) or at one particular club (Torres, Mata) doesn''t mean they''ll hit the same heights elsewhere.We''ve seen plenty of players who excelled on the continent but then failed over here (admittedly we''ve seen many who have succeeded too) so this logic isn''t exactly fool-proof.Who knows, Ricky van Wolfswinkel might be worth £30m now if he had gone to Spain, Germany or another Premier League side...

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Wacky,There are NO guarantees in football with ANY signing, but you play the odds as best you can and accept it will either work or it won''t.Firmino had already steadily improved in the 2 years before his 16 goal season, so it wasn''t a surprise to see him do so well in what was a relatively average Hoffenheim team, but he could just as easily have simply emulated the sort of form from the previous season and not excelled quite as much, but that''s where potential comes in.Everyone knew when Messi was younger that he was something special, everyone knew that Michael Owen had a good chance of being prolific when he broke through (just like they did with Rooney etc), and whilst Firmino isn''t at that sort of level the principle is the same and you place your bets by either going for young potential and hoping it becomes what it can be (such as with Bale and C.Ronaldo) or you go for familiarity with your domestic league and either hope a lower league player can make the step up, or you bring in experience (e.g Crouch etc) and take less of a gamble.Similarly, I also suggested Adam Maher, who struggled somewhat in his first season after the move to PSV but then his innate ability came through the year after and he had a very good season just gone.I personally would rather gamble on a young player from the continent with real potential, than hoping a lower league player can make the step up (which is why I''ll take a Firmino every day over a Mackail-Smith).

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[quote user="Indy_Bones"]Wacky,There are NO guarantees in football with ANY signing, but you play the odds as best you can and accept it will either work or it won''t.Firmino had already steadily improved in the 2 years before his 16 goal season, so it wasn''t a surprise to see him do so well in what was a relatively average Hoffenheim team, but he could just as easily have simply emulated the sort of form from the previous season and not excelled quite as much, but that''s where potential comes in.Everyone knew when Messi was younger that he was something special, everyone knew that Michael Owen had a good chance of being prolific when he broke through (just like they did with Rooney etc), and whilst Firmino isn''t at that sort of level the principle is the same and you place your bets by either going for young potential and hoping it becomes what it can be (such as with Bale and C.Ronaldo) or you go for familiarity with your domestic league and either hope a lower league player can make the step up, or you bring in experience (e.g Crouch etc) and take less of a gamble.Similarly, I also suggested Adam Maher, who struggled somewhat in his first season after the move to PSV but then his innate ability came through the year after and he had a very good season just gone.I personally would rather gamble on a young player from the continent with real potential, than hoping a lower league player can make the step up (which is why I''ll take a Firmino every day over a Mackail-Smith).[/quote]I agree with you to a point- and I think for a club such as ours that point is the price. We had already spent a combined total of, what, roughly £13m on van Wolfswinkel and Fer? Spending a few more million on a player from overseas may have over-egged the pudding further. And even though I''ve always been one to defend Hughton, I''m not sure what the bloody hell he''d have done with Firmino.After the failure of the van Wolfswinkel signing, I can''t see us making any major moves for overseas talent, and rightly so really. As exciting as it is to have a big name arrival from abroad, it probably is a bit too risky at this moment in time if we''re talking the sort of money that van Wolfswinkel cost. If we can pick up a promising player for a couple of million, then go for it, but spending big-money on a Wolf or Firmino would, in my opinion, not be wise this summer.And there''s no way we can start comparing the big-money signings from the continent to decent Championship players, as the cost and ability is too vast.

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I''m not too sure how wise it is for the club to avoid foreign (European) purchases. Some on here have intimated that it''s in large part due to fear of failure post-RVW.But if a British-based player is more expensive than an equivalent continental European player, then surely it makes sense from a risk perspective to go for the cheaper option?Perhaps it would be wiser for the club to invest a bit more in scouting Europe players instead of avoiding them because of a previous high profile transfer not going to plan.

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Krychowiak who I mentioned on Page 1 or 2 was subject to a 9million bid from So''ton (if SkySports are to be believed)... Sevilla told them where to go as his release clause is 22-23million!

I do believe it is only a matter of time though before some of the Poles start to make their way into the Prem. We would be wise to get on board that train early.

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[quote user="93vintage"]I''m not too sure how wise it is for the club to avoid foreign (European) purchases. Some on here have intimated that it''s in large part due to fear of failure post-RVW.But if a British-based player is more expensive than an equivalent continental European player, then surely it makes sense from a risk perspective to go for the cheaper option?Perhaps it would be wiser for the club to invest a bit more in scouting Europe players instead of avoiding them because of a previous high profile transfer not going to plan.[/quote]I didn''t say to avoid it. I just said we shouldn''t risk big money. £2-3m? Fine, let''s take a chance. £8.6m again? That''s a lot of money for a club our size so I think we need to be a bit more sure what we''re getting for that sort of money, i.e. signing players with proven Premier League track records.

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Swansea and Southhampton haven''t done too badly off spending big in the foreign marketplace.

The problem isn''t signing the foreign players, the problem is signing crap ones.

Although to be fair. Wolfy cost 8.6 but we made 5 mill profit on Leroy so it''s swings and roundabouts.

Silly to say we couldn''t spend money on decent players just because they haven''t played in the Prem before. That Benteke lad Villa spent 7mill on hasn''t done too bad for himself either.

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[quote user="kick it off"]Swansea and Southhampton haven''t done too badly off spending big in the foreign marketplace.

The problem isn''t signing the foreign players, the problem is signing crap ones.

Although to be fair. Wolfy cost 8.6 but we made 5 mill profit on Leroy so it''s swings and roundabouts.

Silly to say we couldn''t spend money on decent players just because they haven''t played in the Prem before. That Benteke lad Villa spent 7mill on hasn''t done too bad for himself either.[/quote]Again, I''m not saying we can''t spend on players from overseas, I''m saying that we should be careful. £7m on a player three years ago is already probably the equivalent of £10m+ nowadays, and spending that sort of money on an unproven 21-year-old from Belgium is too big a risk for us.

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We shouldn''t see £8m as a lot of money, we should see it as the going rate for what a quality player costs e.g. Alderwiereld. Spending over £10m is pushing the boat out, but not anything below that really.

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[quote user="Wacky Waving Inflatable Arm Flailing Tube Man"][quote user="93vintage"]I''m not too sure how wise it is for the club to avoid foreign (European) purchases. Some on here have intimated that it''s in large part due to fear of failure post-RVW.But if a British-based player is more expensive than an equivalent continental European player, then surely it makes sense from a risk perspective to go for the cheaper option?Perhaps it would be wiser for the club to invest a bit more in scouting Europe players instead of avoiding them because of a previous high profile transfer not going to plan.[/quote]I didn''t say to avoid it. I just said we shouldn''t risk big money. £2-3m? Fine, let''s take a chance. £8.6m again? That''s a lot of money for a club our size so I think we need to be a bit more sure what we''re getting for that sort of money, i.e. signing players with proven Premier League track records.[/quote]My comment wasn''t aimed at you specifically and I''ve previously questioned the wisdom of shelling out a lot on one player. But I do wonder if we''d be better off going foreign instead of spending big in the domestic market due to the savings being bigger (in absolute terms).RVW for £8.6m was more us trying to push the boat out and avoid spending

£12m or thereabouts on the PL equivalent (without the benefit of

hindsight). Instead of spending £8.6m on a PL player we could perhaps get the equivalent in Europe for around £5m.Is the £3.5m difference worth it for the ''PL proven'' stamp of approval? We could buy a very decent Championship or half-decent PL player with that amount, or even another Europe-based player.Whatever the case, the club shying away from Europe because it''s fearful after a bad experience could prove to be counterproductive imho, especially as British transfer prices are likely to be higher this year with the increase in TV income.

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[quote user="93vintage"][quote user="Wacky Waving Inflatable Arm Flailing Tube Man"][quote user="93vintage"]I''m not too sure how wise it is for the club to avoid foreign (European) purchases. Some on here have intimated that it''s in large part due to fear of failure post-RVW.But if a British-based player is more expensive than an equivalent continental European player, then surely it makes sense from a risk perspective to go for the cheaper option?Perhaps it would be wiser for the club to invest a bit more in scouting Europe players instead of avoiding them because of a previous high profile transfer not going to plan.[/quote]I didn''t say to avoid it. I just said we shouldn''t risk big money. £2-3m? Fine, let''s take a chance. £8.6m again? That''s a lot of money for a club our size so I think we need to be a bit more sure what we''re getting for that sort of money, i.e. signing players with proven Premier League track records.[/quote]My comment wasn''t aimed at you specifically and I''ve previously questioned the wisdom of shelling out a lot on one player. But I do wonder if we''d be better off going foreign instead of spending big in the domestic market due to the savings being bigger (in absolute terms).RVW for £8.6m was more us trying to push the boat out and avoid spending

£12m or thereabouts on the PL equivalent (without the benefit of

hindsight). Instead of spending £8.6m on a PL player we could perhaps get the equivalent in Europe for around £5m.Is the £3.5m difference worth it for the ''PL proven'' stamp of approval? We could buy a very decent Championship or half-decent PL player with that amount, or even another Europe-based player.Whatever the case, the club shying away from Europe because it''s fearful after a bad experience could prove to be counterproductive imho, especially as British transfer prices are likely to be higher this year with the increase in TV income.[/quote]This post here sums the argument in a nutshell.Let''s say we are spending £6m on two players. Same age, same position, but one is an English player from another Premier League club, and one is an African or South American playing in continental Europe. Chances are, the one from overseas is the better player (like you say, there is better value for money abroad) but you have no idea how they will settle into a new country, a more competitive league, and a different style of play.It is risk and reward, and I''m of the opinion that I''d rather spend a little bit more on a domestic signing so we pretty much know what we''re getting, rather than take a chance on somebody who stands just as much chance of sinking than swimming.

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But the players that ''we know what we are getting'' aren''t that good, especially for the extortionate price. Ross McCormack and Jordan Rhodes cost £11m-12m respectively whereas you can buy the likes of Bony for that much and sell them on for £30m

Pelle at Southampton for £7m would now be worth more than double that.

Sakho at West Ham for £4.5m - now worth at least £12m

When you think the likes of Connor Wickham cost £8m, yet has scored no more than 5 goals in a season, poor.

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[quote user="mrs miggins"]But the players that ''we know what we are getting'' aren''t that good, especially for the extortionate price. Ross McCormack and Jordan Rhodes cost £11m-12m respectively whereas you can buy the likes of Bony for that much and sell them on for £30m

Pelle at Southampton for £7m would now be worth more than double that.

Sakho at West Ham for £4.5m - now worth at least £12m

When you think the likes of Connor Wickham cost £8m, yet has scored no more than 5 goals in a season, poor.[/quote]But how did we know how good Bony, Pelle and Sakho were going to be?As it turns out, those three are better signings than the likes of Rhodes, McCormack, Deeney (linked with Burnley and Leicester last summer for around £7m) would''ve been.But then look at the flops:Ricky van Wolfswinkel, £8.6m- poor.Brown Ideye, £10m- poor.Emmanuel Riviere, £6m- poor.Abel Hernandez, £10m- poor.Rhodes, McCormack and Deeney couldn''t have done any worse than these four, and probably would''ve all done better.As I say, it is risk and reward. Some of these signings from Europe are revelations, some are total disasters.

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But you know that if you spend the same or more money on the likes of Rhodes/McCormack, they are not going to score more than 10 goals. There''s an element of luck in buying foreign players (e.g. I''m surprised Sakho did well this year but Hernandez didn''t) but the rewards are often much higher considering there aren''t enough good british based players to match the rest of the teams in the PL. I think therefore it''s wise to have a mix of both reliable signings in which you know what type of limitations the player has as well as foreign players which could flop, in the case of RVW, or could go well. There''s normally a few clubs in the PL each season who find a few gems, I just hope we''ll be one of the clubs. CamJam''s never scored many goals in this league yet scored sh!tloads in the championship. Hooper will need someone with him up top if he''s going to be a success this year and Grabban, well we''ll see. Sometimes treading into the unknown is the best place to find hidden talent. We have to rely on our scouts to find this talent. RVW was not from our scouts, it was Hughton as they (Newcastle) tried to get him whilst he was in charge. So don''t let the RVW fiasco put you off because there are more success stories than failures.

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