Jump to content
Sign in to follow this  
silver fox

Fleming and Doherty - not against Coventry

Recommended Posts

I sincerely hope that the pairing of Fleming and Doherty is not going to be Worthy''s preferred starting central pair against Coventry.  Shackell should have been on from the start against Inter, as opposed to coming on late in the game.  In the short space of time he was on the pitch he showed what a class defender he is turning into.

If all we have to look forward to is watching Doherty and Fleming pass the ball between themselves and then back to the keeper then we are in for some crap games.  Neither of them is comfortable on the ball and panic when challenged by an opponent.  They both also seem incapable of finding a City player when they eventually hoof the ball up the field.

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
This is the most accurate piece of reporting I have ever read!If Worthy persists in playing Craig Fleming then we will ship goals and the morale of the team will be badly affected. Doherty MIGHT be able to ''do a job'' but I would much prefer another centre back - too late for Coventry I''m afraid.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Couldn''t agree more. If Shackell doesn''t start against Coventry and he''s not injured, you have to ask what criteria Worthy uses to pick the team.  On most people''s reckoning Shacks was probably our best player in the second half of last season, one of the few who didn''t look out of his depth. By contrast Fleming is a donkey, no finesse, always rushing up strikers a** and getting turned. When he gets the ball he looks terrified, and either hoofs it or gives someone a hospital ball in his haste to be rid of it.  Frankly he''s an embarrassment to the team, and I agree if he''s the first name on the team sheet this year we''ll ship an extra 20 goals because of him, sowing seeds of discord in the team.  Doherty isn''t a world beater but he''s not really been given a decent run, and will need time to settle in at the middle of the defence.  He''s more intelligent than Flem, more agile, and a real threat in the air in the opposition box for corners, which shouldn''t be underestimated.  He could nick us half a dozen goals a season, like Malky used to.  How come every fan you seem to talk to thinks Doherty and Shackell should be the two centre backs, but Worthy keeps persisting out of misguided loyalty, which will cost the club dear. It''s so frustrating when you see Donkey Flem trot out onto the pitch, and a genuine talent like Shackell on the bench, it makes you want to bang your head against the wall in frustration.   And don''t get me started on Henderson.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
like or not; these are the centre-backs that we have (barring any unlikely transfer coups that Worthy may pull off...). Flem has always given his best and granted that was not always enough in the Prem,it has been, and will be in MHO enough in the Championship. My personal affection for Flem aside, I do honestly believe that the Doc and Shacks will be the partnership of the future ( or at the very least the best and most viable partnership we could forge at the back) until we regain our rightful premiership status that we deserve. The Doc has never been given his chance (given the money we paid for him). Granted he was brought in as a "utility" player, but the man sometimes oozes class. The Doc has lost a bit of (must needed) weight and is more mobile than ever... all I ask is that he be given a fair chance come the start of the season. Some of his performances for the Republic of Ireland have been astoundingly good. Please; allow him to do the same for our great club.This is all I ask...

Still nervous, but forever optimistic...

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
I cant quite understand why Doherty gets such a kicking on here. Always seemed to be the first and easiest target last season. I''ll tell you this, worthy and the coaching staff are made up with his response to criticism at the end of last season about his weight and attitude, and consider him to be a real bonus. I think he has a huge part to play this season. I think he will score a fair few goals as well, judging by our new tactic of hitting corners long for the four big lads at the back of the area to attack. Watch out for a more physical Norwich City this term. And give Doherty a break. at least the lad WANTS to play for us.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

The youngsters have to be given their chance - Shacks is a natural leader (put Flem to shame last season with his organisation and cajoling) and Doc will get better with a run of games (after all who does NOT get  turned by Adriano?)   

If an experienced player were to partner shacks it would have to be CHarlie, whos years in the prem showed through with his footballing ability last year.  He is a far far better defender (and has a bigger impact in the middle than on the left where Drury is his equal) than Flem but he too should be back up only while we try out our younger future stars.

 

OTBC

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

must admit I share the concern that from the friendly line-ups it does look like Doc/Flem partnership. Personally, I would find it astonishing if Shackell was left out. As for Doc/Flem I actually prefer the latter as a partner for JC. Doc was poor in both Essex matches. Still, i wouldn''t say no to a decent right-footed purchase!

 

As for the repeated references to Mackay people need to get real. It was Flem who - justifiably -won PotY 2003/04 NOT Mackay. Just because Malky didn''t have the chance to get skinned every week in the Premiership doesn''t make him preferable and from what I''ve seen of Pardew''s line-ups from last season and his summer buys make its extremely unlikely that malky will feature in the WHU defence at all this coming season.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Maybe the reason that Shackell didn''t play against Inter is because Worthy has already decided that he is a definite starter and wanted Flem and Doherty playing at the same time to make it easier to pick between them.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

[quote]Maybe the reason that Shackell didn''t play against Inter is because Worthy has already decided that he is a definite starter and wanted Flem and Doherty playing at the same time to make it easier to p...[/quote]

We can only hope!

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
I also agree that Charlton should appear in the first team squad, whether at the back or midfield. Shackell should be our first choice centre back, whether alongside Charlton,Docherty or Fleming we will have to see. Personally I think Worthy should rebuild his defence, we sit too deep all the time!!

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Doherty is not given a fair chance, because he consistently shows how bad he is. He may have lost some timber, but he certainly has not gained any pace, well at least there was no clear evidence against Inter.

If you were at the Inter game, you would have seen that almost immediately from kick off when he was nutmegged. And dont get me started on the first goal, his awareness was shocking.

Fleming was also fairly shocking at times on Friday night, especially when he up ended Adriano in front of the Jarrold Stand, but pushing him squarely in the face, and although the Inter player made a very big meal of it, Fleming just shrugged his shoulders. Unbelievable.

Shackell, well he is total quality, and I just hope we get another centre half in before too long.

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
I hope it''s going to be Shacks and Charlton at the back. I have no confidence in Doherty, watching him makes me far too nervous.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Yawn, more Doc bashing.

Everyone watches for his mistakes (even though ALL our players make them throughout the game INCLUDING Shackell), but no-one watches him for the good things he does. Just like Holt, Svensson, Helveg, Rivers, Easton etc etc etc etc. Ahhh, did he get caught out by Adriano and Obafenmi Martins? Well, that really shows us he''s crap, huh?

Give the Doc a decent run in the team, give him a little confidence (ie don''t write him off after a couple of games or go nuts after every mistake even though Hux loses the ball thirty times per game) and see then if he is good enough. Fleming has proved that he is NOT good enough at the "top" level, Shackell hasn''t yet done enough to prove he can cut it for a whole season.

Doc and Charlton are the only defenders we have that have so far proved they have what it takes at the top-ish level - give Doc a chance.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Go to say I agree with Mock also.

I''m happy with whatever our manager deems to be our best pairing at the back. I''ll give them a chance and reserve judgement. Nigel has the privilege of seeing our players day in and day out. He also has a better awareness of their attitude and desire and belief. Its certainly not always about pure ability. We need to pick the players who are most up for the challenge. Its also not about lack of pace either. Bruce and Pallister, Adams and Keown, hardly a shabby centre back pairings! (in their time)

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Thanks for your agreements, people. Those that don''t agree must suffer from mid-term memory loss.

Honestly, who can forget the overweight, gap-toothed Welshman that arrived as a "has-been" with his confidence shot to pieces not so long ago?

And remember what he achieved at our club.

Doc is younger at 25, and has the best years of his career in front of him. He wants to play for us, he offers us a lot as a player. Let''s not write him off until he has truly proved to us either way that he can or cannot cut the mustard.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

how many more poor performancesfrom GD before we accept that he is truly not good enough then?

and as for the reference point.. yes IW came good i but ''m sure that could easily be countered with references to players that haven''t.

the point is that whilst its harsh on the players its going to be a very tough division  to get out of so we can''t afford to carry players unless we want another 9 seasons in the 2nd tier .

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

"how many more poor performancesfrom GD before we accept that he is truly not good enough then?"

Well I don''t know.

How many have we had so far? I can count about two.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

you only counting friendlies then?

oh well, guess we''ll have to beg to differ.

there seems to be 2 streams of posts for and against Doc''s inclusion.

Despite my negative comments I sincerely hope he is a success.

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I''ve not seen the ''new stone less Ginger pele'', but judging from the posts put in so far on this subject I''d go for a Shackell-Fleming partnership at the back, with Charlton at Right back.

My reason for Fleming is, you need someone to stay home while your partner goes out to work!

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Fair enough FTFW, we''ll agree to disagree over Doc.

If the crowd don''t crucify him for every mistake, eventually his confidence will return and I''m sure we''ll see a good player for it. And because of my positive comments, I sincerely hope he is a success, otherwise I will look a fool!

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

[quote]I''ve not seen the ''new stone less Ginger pele'', but judging from the posts put in so far on this subject I''d go for a Shackell-Fleming partnership at the back, with Charlton at Right back. My reason...[/quote]

Charlton right back!! Did you go to Blackburn away last year??

Please...No!! It is the only time Charlton has had a really bad game... Colin Right back, with MLJ in front of him please. Thanks Worthy.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now
Sign in to follow this  

×
×
  • Create New...