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CANARYKING

Marc Tierney retires on medical grounds

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Great memories of him during our Championship winning season, loved the cart wheels after a win. Best of luck to him in the future.

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Hopefully it wasn''t those back flips in the rain that caused it!

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He started the season really well and then got injured I think- Naughton had to fill in at LB for quite a bit of that season. Never really a Hughton sort of player either.

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Sadly another victim of Chris Hughton''s god awful tenure in charge here, much like Fox, Surman, C.Martin, Vaughan, Becchio & Butterfield...Really helped our promotion push and was excellent for the first half of the season in the prem until unfortunately getting badly injured, then he never got a look in again when that sh!tter took over and was sold soon after.Along with removing any goalscoring ability from the strikers and playing the worst football I''ve seen from our club in the past 20 years I''m almost shocked that we''ve quickly recovered from this dire period and are still in with a chance to go straight back up!

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Will be remembered with some fondness for the promotion season and to a degree in the first season back in the prem. However, when Garrido, Turner and Bassong came in, we looked far better without him. On the ball and defensively he wasn''t as good as Garrido. I can remember a number of occasions where he was caught out of position, through bad positioning, where he ended up committing a foul. In some cases he''d foul if he just got beaten, or pull players back, and not in the positions you would want him to.A decent player for us at that time, but replacing him with Garrido which led to a defensively meaner team, was not a mistake for me.

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[quote user="Indy_Bones"]Sadly another victim of Chris Hughton''s god awful tenure in charge here, much like Fox, Surman, C.Martin, Vaughan, Becchio & Butterfield...

Really helped our promotion push and was excellent for the first half of the season in the prem until unfortunately getting badly injured, then he never got a look in again when that sh!tter took over and was sold soon after.

Along with removing any goalscoring ability from the strikers and playing the worst football I''ve seen from our club in the past 20 years I''m almost shocked that we''ve quickly recovered from this dire period and are still in with a chance to go straight back up!
[/quote]

There''s maybe a cause that Surman could have played a bigger part. But particularly with Vaughan and Butterfield he got it right and really the others too.

 

In the last 20 years Norwich have been much worse than they were under Hughton. Wasn''t that long ago we were putting up with dross like Chris Killen, Gow and Fotheringham etc.

 

As for Tierney, I wouldn''t have considered him "excellent" in the Prem. He did alright. No more than that. He was replaced by a better defender and player.

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[quote user="GJP"]There''s maybe a cause that Surman could have played a bigger part. But particularly with Vaughan and Butterfield he got it right and really the others too.In the last 20 years Norwich have been much worse than they were under Hughton. Wasn''t that long ago we were putting up with dross like Chris Killen, Gow and Fotheringham etc.[/quote]Vaughan had looked good in pre-season (probably our most dangerous looking striker tbh) but was then suddenly shipped out on loan for absolutely no apparent reason leaving us with just 3 stikers in Holt, Morison and Jackson, and he''s since been pretty damn good at Huddersfield (admittedly this is Champs not Prem).Butterfield was never even given a chance and since went on to have a decent spell at Boro, but a much better one this year at Huddersfield where he''s been pretty impressive in many of their games according to a Hudd fan I know.Martin has been smashing them in for fun since joining Derby, and whilst I couldn''t pick Fox over our current midfield options there were clearly numerous games under Hughton where we were crying out for his distribution in the middle of the park.Becchio looked decent enough for the handful of minutes Hughton gave him, but much like with the Vaughan situation, we had strikers like Elmander and RvW who simply couldn''t find the back of the net most of the time yet Becchio was sat getting splinters instead of seeing what he could actually offer.As for us being much worse previously than we were under Hughton, I''d argue ths point all day. From a player ability perspective we definitely have had MUCH worse ''teams'', but when it comes to the standard of football being offered up, none of these inferior teams has even played as badly as we did under much of Hughton''s tenure. It was horrible, soul-sucking, negative dross that even a 1-0 win was hard to enjoy because the 90 minutes of football had been such a shockingly poor display it kind of removed any fun and enjoyment out of the result...

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Glad to see that everyone''s moved on from Hughton then...

As for Marc Tierney, he did pretty well for us, and I''ll always a shame when a pro has to retire early on medical grounds. Probably going to be remembered best for his cartwheels!

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I don''t eat bread on medical grounds, but when i''m not at the doctors i eat it all the time!!!! *boom tish!*

...what?

*Walks away dejected*

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[quote user="Indy_Bones"] Fox, Surman, C.Martin, Vaughan, Becchio & Butterfield...

[/quote]and yet loo0king at them since leaving Norwich (Surman and Martin Apart) might suggest Hughton was right?

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Sad to see he has retired injured.

However it seems that sepia is tinting his capabilities with us; was good at champs level, attacking well and strong in the tackle. Unfortunately his limitations were soon exposed in the prem and while he did ok left back was an area to strengthen before his unfortunate injury.

Letting him leave at the end of his contract was clearly the right thing to do having already secured another prem season and having better options at the club.

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[quote user="jas the barclay king"]and yet loo0king at them since leaving Norwich (Surman and Martin Apart) might suggest Hughton was right?[/quote]Not in the slightest.Don''t forget that it''s not just about the players AFTER they left, it''s their complete misuse/abuse DURING their time under CH which also plays a part.We struggle for goals, so rather than playing Becchio who''d hit goals for fun at this level before joining us, he instead playing Kei Kamara who managed 1 in 11. We needed more quality in the middle of the park and calmer distribution, but instead of giving Fox a fair chance to provide this, he was basically relegated to the reserves and never seen again apart from a cup game where the whole team were sh!t. Martin, Vaughan, Butterfield and Surman have all performed well for their respective clubs since leaving us, so I struggle to see your point here Jas.I think many fans would have C.Martin back here again, Surman is more than good enough, and for a 4th choice striker Vaughan is as good as anyone IMHO at the right price. Foxy and possibly Becchio are the only two who''d not really warrant a place in our current setup as even Butterfield would have impressed as a midfield backup option.Lots of opinion on this one, but refusing to play good players when we clearly needed them was a major downfall of CH, and he played dross like Kamara and Elmander whilst the likes of Vaughan and Martin were shipped out instead...

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[quote user="Indy_Bones"]It was horrible, soul-sucking, negative dross that even a 1-0 win was hard to enjoy because the 90 minutes of football had been such a shockingly poor display it kind of removed any fun and enjoyment out of the result...[/quote]People have very selective memories.... there were some really good displays in amongst the not so good ones. Take these games last season and tell me they weren''t good competitive performances - Everton homeChelsea home (even though we lost, it was a strong performance)Cardiff at home - non stop attackingWH at home - strong second half comebackWBA asway - good 2-0 against the oddsMan U at home - strong performance againMan City home 0-0 - terrific display.Tottenham at home - battling and competitive win.Sunderland at home - good display, 2-0 winYes, there were some difficult to watch matches too, but that''s football.  The first season we had a great spell too, up to the Man City game after Christmas and there weren''t that many complaints at the performances up to then.   It was a mixed bag.  People accuse me of  Hughton being a favourite of mine - its not really the case - I just prefer to see the whole picture, not just getting on a massive downer because things were difficult.  It was hard and it was a struggle and it got to everyone in the end, including the manager, which is why I keep going on about being positive.  In football, you have to try and be positive, whatever the situation - fans and players alike.  If not you get a viscious circle of negativity which is hard to break out of and it affects and filters through to everyone at a club - most of all the players.

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Surely Hughton''s failure was who he replaced the players with rather than the decision to replace them. Because, if these players were the ones to take us to the next level, why haven''t even a promoted club taken a chance on them.

 

 

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LDC, your constant defence of Hughton is tedious.

He adopted some of the most negative, boring anti-football I''ve ever seen and it was a great day when he was sacked.

He turned a bunch of lads, who while not world beaters, had confidence and a great fighting spirit into a group of confidence free footballers.

A few decent games here and there doesn''t make up for 18 months of dross.

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[quote user="Indy_Bones"][quote user="jas the barclay king"]and yet loo0king at them since leaving Norwich (Surman and Martin Apart) might suggest Hughton was right?[/quote]Not in the slightest.Don''t forget that it''s not just about the players AFTER they left, it''s their complete misuse/abuse DURING their time under CH which also plays a part.We struggle for goals, so rather than playing Becchio who''d hit goals for fun at this level before joining us, he instead playing Kei Kamara who managed 1 in 11. We needed more quality in the middle of the park and calmer distribution, but instead of giving Fox a fair chance to provide this, he was basically relegated to the reserves and never seen again apart from a cup game where the whole team were sh!t. Martin, Vaughan, Butterfield and Surman have all performed well for their respective clubs since leaving us, so I struggle to see your point here Jas.I think many fans would have C.Martin back here again, Surman is more than good enough, and for a 4th choice striker Vaughan is as good as anyone IMHO at the right price. Foxy and possibly Becchio are the only two who''d not really warrant a place in our current setup as even Butterfield would have impressed as a midfield backup option.Lots of opinion on this one, but refusing to play good players when we clearly needed them was a major downfall of CH, and he played dross like Kamara and Elmander whilst the likes of Vaughan and Martin were shipped out instead...[/quote]Some stats would say otherwise. In the two seasons he has been at Huddersfield since leaving us, Vaughn has made 47 appearances scoring 17 times. 26 of those appearances have been this season, as have 7 goals (and 7 yellow cards). Butterfield was used as a makeweight by Middlesborough for Clayton who they saw as being more important for their squad than Butterfield. Both of whom play for a team who at best can be considered a mid table championship side, but the reality is that at the moment they are performing in the bottom half of the league.I agree with Nutty as well, Martin leaving was as much about the players coming in. They were not good enough. I would rather have given Elmander''s games to Martin last season, he could have done no worse in my opinion. And certainly offered more than RVW  did.But as I said earlier in the thread, Tierney was not one of the ones missed, and he wasn''t suddenly cast away either. He remained for a season to compete with Garrido and for me, it was clear that Garrido was the better player.In fact I would go as far as saying that the best bit of work that Hughton did with our squad was in defense. We went from a team with Barnett, Ward, Whitbread and Tierney to one with Bassong, Turner and Garrido. I would take the latter every time over the former. And what is worth highlighting again, is that it was progressive, he didn''t get rid of all those players, he kept some and added.When you look at the midfield, I''m not sure he did so badly there either. He brought in Snodgrass, Tettey and Redmond. Fox was a casualty, like the others, of our rapid rise.It is really going forward where Hughton struggled. We allowed the likes of Jackson, Martin, Morrison and Holt to leave without really bringing in adequate replacements. Last season we had Elmander, RVW, Hooper and Becchio. The latter wasn''t really given a chance. Of the other three only Hooper could be considered an equal or step up to the likes of Martin or Holt.Overall for me, I felt that Hughton was genuinely trying to make us tactically more flexible, but without an attacking game that was working we nearly always fell back into a defensive mindset. At any level, if the ball isn''t sticking when it goes up top, and if your strikers are not consistent enough and making the most of the chances they get, you will see teams slowly sit deeper and deeper as games go on. The overall play will become more negative as players lose confidence in other players ability. People will stop making as many forward runs due to feeling the ball won''t stick and therefore leave them a lot of ground to track back or just out of position. It all feeds into each other.To a certain degree you saw that with Middlesborough when Bamford was injured.But Hughton did fail to address that, he didn''t change things enough or he was unable to get the team playing well going forward. In the premier league, that will always cost you.

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jas the barclay king wrote the following post at 24/04/2015 12:03 PM:

Indy_Bones wrote:

Fox, Surman, C.Martin, Vaughan, Becchio & Butterfield...

and yet loo0king at them since leaving Norwich (Surman and Martin Apart) might suggest Hughton was right?

How can HUghton be right when he wasted a lot of money on two of them?

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