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There's a lot of talk about "breaking through the lines". We don't even have any lines for our opponents to break through. Ipswich just strolled through our midfield most of the match, then came up against a resolute back 5. They wouldn't have equalised at all if Barnes hadn't tried to help out. At the start of the season, we defended from the front (Sargent and Barnes being crucial to that) - Idah and Hwang are much less effective at that - but even then once past our forwards our midfield "line" was non-existent. That's what I find so frustrating - our issues seem to be so patently obvious, yet our coaches continue to not address them.

Stoke are perhaps the ultimate example of a megarich owner making absolutely no difference whatsoever. And I suspect Schumacher will also make no difference whatsoever. Like many others, they need to re-invent their recruitment policy.

Any forum will eventually attract a few posters who don't play by the rules. The mods job is to kick them off, as quickly as possible. If you don't have mods then sometimes it degenerates, as it has on here on occasion. But surely, you can also moderate your own experience. I just don't look at those threads which fall into arguments. I have also blocked some posters who gave me what I considered to be unreasonable abuse for holding a different view ( this includes some supposedly "respected" regular posters) because I have no interest in their opinions any longer, and I have no respect for them. Unlike LDC, I have had no mental health issues but I can understand why you would because some people have no concept of the impact of what they are saying. Personally my rule has always been - would I say this to the person's face in the pub? I think I agree with most posters on here much of the time, but not always; just like that chat over a pint. Some people don't rate Kenny Maclean as a footballer - I think they're wrong. I have the same arguments every week! That's the way of the world; people see different things and when you introduce passion and commitment they say things they shouldn't when they are protected by distance on a keyboard. A first step to a fairer, friendlier forum would be to ban "in match" threads - some of the comments then are just outrageous.

I've never understood the Steve Cooper love in. Never thought his teams were particularly good to watch or effective. Not sure how much impact he had on recruitment but a lot of rubbish has arrived at Forest for a lot of money. They still don't have the players they need to be able to keep clean sheets in the EPL and I suspect they'll be spending heavily again in January. Lots of players there we could look at though.

I don't think we need much at all to make our plan A team quite good. Assuming Sargent and Hwang recover well, we're well covered up front. The Kenny at CB experiment appears to have legs (so credit to Wagner for that) and alongside Duffy (who was excellent on Saturday) or Hanley that weakness should be fixed. Wide areas are sorted - I don't like Fassnacht or Hernandez as back ups but they're here and they're not going anywhere. Fullbacks are a problem for me - I'd like to see a loan in both positions as none of our current options are good enough. I'd let Giannoulis and MaCullum go as neither can defend or have good enough engines to be wingbacks. We have the creativity in midfield in Nunez and Sara. We have to get them further forward. Whether that means a CDM or a more defensively minded CM is debatable. But we need someone - Gibbs may be the future here, but he's not there yet. I liked the Barnes signing at the time and I still think he can bring something we don't have.

There seem to be two issues on this thread - is our squad good enough to make the playoffs and if they do what is the point of winning them? To be fair, these were discussion points before the season even started. What is the point of competing to win a league when being promoted is completely pointless? The only way it isn't pointless is if Mr A chooses to finance a splurge in the transfer market - always possible I guess, but why would he? So yes, being promoted is pointless. On that basis, our best season is to lose in the PO final, but we wouldn't want to lose having got there would we? So should we lose in the SF's? Maybe, unless we're playing Ipswich. But if we do get up to 6th we're not going to want to lose are we? So maybe 7th is the best option. But then we lose half our income next season whereas if we do get promoted we can reset again and maybe keep Rowe, Sara, Gunn, Gibbs, Nunez and Sargent as the basis of a half decent team. Even when we come straight back we get two more years of parachute money and it's two years of developing Kamara, Tomkinson, Hills, Ryes, Aboh and Fisher etc. That's where we are. That's our position in the football pyramid. So is our squad good enough to get us to 6th. Yes, it is. On song, with confidence and belief we could make 5th or 6th. A lot depends on these "exciting" January plans. A couple of decent Arsenal loanees (Smith Rowe? You're having a laugh!) would help. What I'd really love is for us to win the PO's and then just announce that we're not going to try and compete because it's pointless; because the football model is broken so that we force the powers that be to at least recognise the problem. But they won't of course - they'll just let Talksport badmouth us again. Maybe I'd really rather finish 7th and have a happy year watching 1p5wich get stuffed week after week instead of us.

I just can't see Wagner and his "coaching" staff coping with McKenna's. A sound defeat I think, hopefully no more than 3-0. Wagner will then say we played well and that Fassnacht in particular had a good game, despite him ball-watching for the last two goals and that Hernandez was always a threat. He will go on to say that Gibbs is the best striker on the books and Maclean was again outstanding at centreback. And they still won't sack him.

It's their turn. It's just the way football goes. Ours will come again.

The number of players we have moved on for decent money over the years who have failed to progress is really quite amazing. As for Godfrey, I suspect this is just Dyche playing the market again to generate some offers in January for a player he doesn't rate. He knows CB's - he was one, plus he sussed Gibson out in a couple of games. I wouldn't have Godfey back if they paid us to take him. Getting £20m plus for him was genius PR at work. Like Omo, he isn't actually a very good defender.

Or maybe they could pay more than £10 on buyback to encourage those who can't go to register their seats more often. Strange that we have such a waiting list, yet never seem to sell out.

The way we are playing at the moment, they will destroy us. They attack with speed through the middle and counter well, so even if we do get any pressure they're still a threat. I don't think we have the players to stop them now, and Wagner tactically is simply no match for their guy. Sargent maybe would have given them something to think about, and Rowe could if he gave a t++s, but defensively we don't have a prayer. I would never "settle" for any kind of defeat at Portman Road, but if you gave me a fighting draw I'd take it. Our only chance is that Man Utd sack their manager and steal McKenna before next weekend. But even then, I suspect they'd still do us.

So the four year deal he got in the middle of that summer when we kind of knew Buendia was on his bike already was what then? Advance compensation? Farke had started to get a tune out of some of those signings and whilst that Brentford win was fortunate, there was a reason to be positive as we had 3 winnable games to follow after a very tough start. Webber panicked and pulled the trigger too early. And it was never the plan for that to happen.

What's Haaland gonna do when his looks go?

The first was (should have been) a pretty standard save; the second was a deflection but he made no effort to move his feet or claim the cross - not just his fault, mind; the third it bounced away from him - again! Goalkeepers at this level should be saving that - at least pushing it away from danger. He got away with one almost identical shot in the first half. I think Gunn would have stopped the first and third.

That's good advice, which I will be taking because I'm not going to watch these incompetent morons any more.

I didn't expect anything this season to be honest. I never thought we had a chance of the top two, and the Playoffs were a big ask while we tried to rebuild/consolidate. I thought that meant we'd blood the youngsters alongside some old stagers to give them a bit of belief and steel. I thought that was what Barnes and Duffy were for. Did we ever think we could miss Josh Sargent this much? I assumed, somewhat naively, that we would actually play our biggest summer signing when he was fit, rather than stick with a player who was deemed not good enough for us in this league 3 seasons ago. Even so, I simply cannot believe the incompetence on display by our manager and coaching staff. The inability to see what is happening in front of their eyes. The lack of understanding on how to set up a team and how to ask players to perform. The stubbornness of sticking to the same format and expecting something different to happen. The fact that Fassnacht, time and time and time again ball watches rather mark or press his man, and no one shouts at him. That doesn't happen on a Sunday morning! David Wagner may well be a lovely bloke. A football manager he is not. He is completely out of his depth. I'd much rather see Reyes in goal than Long if Gunn is still unfit. I'd rather see Fisher, Warner, Sainz and Gibbs starting. I'd rather get Tomkinson and Kamara back from their loans in January and get them in the squad. And finally.................sign a fn**ckign defensive midfielder!!!!!!!!

I could make our players better. Anyone with half a brain cell could make our players better.

Dreadful, dreadful second half. Millwall's reserve keeper showing why he was Millwall's reserve keeper. Why is Hernandez still on the pitch? Why is Wagner still in a job?

For 20 minutes we were really good, then for some reason we stopped playing. Sara should have closed down Kone and Long should have saved his shot. For the second both Long and Baath were taken out by a defection, but both were already in the wrong place for the cross. Personally I'd have brought Nunez on for Hwang, not Barnes. So much ball watching, not enough marking and pressing. Fassnacht and Hernandez both invisible and both need to be substituted - get Gibbs and Sainz on. Watford were equally rubbish though. They also have a useless manager with no idea, no plan of how to play and no organisation.

This could explain why I don't really like watching football anymore, if coaches are genuinely doing this. What a shame that those youngsters don't play the game for love, rather than results. Re the restaurant analogy - I might go back to that restaurant to give it a second chance, but I probably won't keep going if the food continues to be bad. The purpose of complaining is to improve the standard isn't it?

Well, I guess that's a novel way of winning a football match.

By the time he makes his offer, the way the club is going £25 a share will look like he's overpaying.

A great example of how a manager can improve a player. He'll never be as good for anyone else or anywhere else so hopefully for him Howe stays for a few more years. One of the relatively few players Norwich have sold over many years who have gone on to reach the heights of the game.

Did they all come from Millwall then?

I think this is spot on - BUT it would help if Wagner didn't keep messing with a performing team with really, really stupid substitutions which in the last 3 games have probably cost us 6 points. Whoever is telling him to do it should move on....