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horsefly

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Posts posted by horsefly


  1. 15 hours ago, Fen Canary said:

    I’ll wager Horsey will now try and justify the right of trans women (biological males) to work in the rape crisis centre, despite just just now saying he understands why males should be excluded from them. However I agree, trying to link a rape centre with a racist policy of segregation is scraping the barrel somewhat 

    Pathetic! Try reading what I ACTUALLY said instead of desperately trying to excuse your ignorance. I purposely DID NOT conflate rape with racism. The point of the analogy was a very simple one (not simple enough for you and the other far-right buffoons of course), that there are social contexts in which it is entirely justifiable to exclude certain people from a venue. Nothing more, nothing less was implied by what I said. Certainly NOT the deliberate and utterly disingenuous tripe concocted by the usual suspects that I was claiming rape is the same as racism. I note that NONE of you answered the question I posed about whether it would be justifiable to exclude men from performances on a play dealing with rape. But that is a lot harder for you than when it comes to pushing your faux outrage about so-called black racism.


  2. The ludicrousness of the far-right buffoons on this thread is as hilarious as it is pathetic. Spittle-flecked old white men expressing faux outrage that they are to be excluded from just 2 performances of a play about the evils of slavery that they would never have considered attending in a million years. The very personification of disingenuous frauds desperate to find a cause to vent some hate of minorities.

    • Like 1

  3. 44 minutes ago, Naturalcynic said:

    Ah, so you’re putting your head above the parapet now that some others have.

     

    42 minutes ago, Naturalcynic said:

    Another one bravely deciding to now nail his/her hypocritical colours to the mast, having seen that some of his/her ideological bedfellows have done likewise.

    You've misunderstood being a cynic for being a nasty git.

    • Like 1

  4. 7 minutes ago, Naturalcynic said:

    Absolute cobblers.  A theatre is not a rape crisis centre and no black person living in the UK has been a victim of historic slavery.  Totally false equivalence to try to defend the indefensible.

    And still not a single attempt to answer any of the questions. Just your standard bigoted lashing out at a challenge to your set beliefs.


  5. 1 minute ago, Naturalcynic said:

    Hahahaha!  Are you sure you were a university lecturer?  Actually, given some of the rather extreme stuff you come out with on here, you probably were a university lecturer.

    So the man that constantly whines on about being a victim of abuse has nothing material to say in response to the issues raised but just offers sneering abusive ad hominem attacks.


  6. 2 hours ago, Naturalcynic said:

    As I said in the title to the thread, perhaps this is considered by some to be the right sort of racism, an acceptable version of discrimination on the grounds of skin colour.  Personally I think any mealy-mouthed attempt at justification is plain double standards, unless of course they’d also support the idea of, for example, whites only nights in restaurants, or boarding houses saying no blacks, no dogs, no Irish.

    Utter tripe! On what grounds would there be a reason to have whites only nights in restaurants? what prejudiced based trauma related issues are raised by the environment of a restaurant? Pathetic whataboutery nonsense. The grounds for 2 nights of black only audiences in a play about slavery have been very clearly articulated and only opaque to those without the willingness to attempt an understanding.


  7. When I was a lecturer an Asian student who I got on very well with disclosed to me that she had been raped late at night on the university car park. Given her specific cultural background she felt she could not say anything about the dreadful incident to her husband or any of her family. The trauma she was clearly suffering left me feeling powerless as to know what to do. Thus I contacted the rape crisis centre to get some advice. When I asked if I could come along with her to the centre to provide support I was very firmly told no. They explained to me that for very obvious reasons this was a women only space. Was I offended? Did I think this was an impertinent imposition on my equal rights as a man? Obviously not. The reasons for such a policy were indisputable. The current dispute over the slavery play are nowhere near as awful as the hideous event I just relayed. However, the explanation for why they have chosen to reserve two performances for black only audiences exists on the same axis of sensitivity. Not far enough up that axis to ban white people from all performances in the way that it is justifiable to ban all men from a women's rape crisis centre. 


  8. 20 minutes ago, Naturalcynic said:

    Black people living in the UK were not and are not victims of slavery!  And resorting to labelling me a bigot really is pathetic.  After all, I’m not the one condoning a clear case of racial discrimination.

    Britain traded 2.3 million slaves. When the Slavery Abolition Act was passed, there were 46,000 slave owners in this country. Black people clearly WERE victims of slavery in this country in their tens of thousands. The majority of the current black population can trace ancestors who were enslaved by the British either here or in other parts of the empire. On what planet do you exist? 

    And resorting to labelling me as "coming out of the woodwork" really is pathetic (see why I called you a bigot now?).

    And I also see you have refused to answer the question asking whether you would object to a play about rape reserving a couple of nights for women only audiences. 


  9. 25 minutes ago, Naturalcynic said:

    I think we’ll have to agree to differ on that!

    Well f**K me! Life is full of surprises. 

    So answer this question: Can you go to see this play yourself if you so wish?

    The answer, btw, is yes. NO white person is being prevented from seeing this play. So please explain how it constitutes racism to reserve just 2 nights for black only audiences. Their reasons for making those sessions available couldn't be clearer and have nothing to do with racism.

     

     


  10. 7 minutes ago, Nik Vawn said:

    I suspect the SNP will see a glimmer of hope here and exploit their more pro Palestine position to the potential disadvantage of Scottish Labour. Long way to go though.

    It was the only reason for the SNPs very carefully worded amendment on Gaza. It was intended to divide Labour, not assist the Palestinians in Gaza. That's why they were so angry when Hoyle allowed Labour's more inclusive amendment to proceed.


  11. 7 minutes ago, Naturalcynic said:

    Sadly, but predictably, some are coming out of the woodwork.

    Sadly, but predictably the usual unimaginative bigots are seeking to exploit division rather than show understanding of the lives and perspectives of others who have been victims of prejudice.


  12. 1 minute ago, Naturalcynic said:

    So in essence you’re in favour of racism if it’s the right kind of racism.  

    It's not racism. People of ALL colours are welcome to see the play. Reserving a couple of performances for black only audiences, given the nature of the issues directly confronted, simply shows sensitivity to the trauma slavery still evokes. I shall endeavour to see the play myself if I get the chance, but I certainly wouldn't attempt to force my way in on the couple of nights reserved for a black only audience on some feigned principle. If a play that dealt explicitly with the issue of rape reserved some performances for women only audiences would you insist on forcing your way in claiming equality for men?


  13. 3 minutes ago, Barbe bleu said:

    It's only going to be for a few months. Realistically an established MP can only do so much across and entire parliamentary career, a new MP is really not going to change much other than the sign on the door in whatever time there is before election purdah starts

    There will be some labour party members that claim that coming fourth in a race you didnt start is a great result but the only people they will be fooling is themselves.  Whether this is a bad result for SKS and his defensive tory-but-competant-tory  messaging depends on what happens next.   He has an exposed left flank and could well lose heavily if some form of Galloway-corbynista party could emerge. Or maybe he'll get the message that not being the Conservatives isn't enough.

    The idea that there is any enthusiasm for a Corbynista style new political party is thoroughly disabused by the last general election result. This was a by-election in which Galloway focussed entirely upon galvanising Muslim discontent at what is happening in Gaza. The idea that the next general election will be fought and won on that single issue is for the birds. Galloway's "party" will not gain a single seat, nor take any significant Labour votes when people will be voting for what government they want in control of the country for the next 5-years.


  14. 13 minutes ago, Naturalcynic said:

    So why did he get elected?  Does he attract the odious extremist bigot vote?

    There was no Labour candidate. Had there been, he would have not been elected. 


  15. 2 hours ago, Deptford Yellow said:

    Well, puts it in context maybe?

    I’m not defending it as such, but I think minority experience is not the same as majority experience and if they feel they want or need some space to explore that then I’m not going to be affronted by that … There’s a lot going on out there in the world that I ‘d rather save my ire for ……

    Spot on! People of all colours are welcome to the vast majority of other performances of the play. The play itself directly confronts the dreadful exploitation, abuse, and murder of millions of black people by white oppressors. To reserve a couple of nights for black only audiences for people of colour who would find it difficult to sit with white people given the subject matter, troubles me not one iota. Likewise if a play about rape was to reserve a couple of performances for women only audiences, I as a man would also have no problem whatsoever. 

    • Like 3

  16. 16 minutes ago, Herman said:

    A Gaza referendum played upon by a rotten human but clever politician. A shame for Rochdale, they need much better representation. 

    Indeed! Rochdale has been ravaged by 14-years of corrupt and incompetent Tory rule. So who does their new MP identify as his only target, Kier Starmer. Galloway shamefully used the Rochdale electorate to continue his long personal vendetta against the Labour Party who kicked his rotten extremist **** out of the party.

    Ironically there is a genuine opportunity here for the Labour Party to use this to their advantage. Every time extremist drivel pours out of Galloway's mouth, Labour will be able to say, "That's exactly why we threw odious extremist bigots like him out of the party. The Labour Party under Starmer is a changed party, it has NO place for hate-mongering divisive people like him". 

    • Like 1

  17. 53 minutes ago, Rock The Boat said:

    The worst possible result for Labour. Beaten into fourth place in a Labour stronghold by an anti semitic ideologue. Doesn't look good for the future of the UK

    Oh dear! There was NO Labour candidate in Rochdale. Thus it's a bloody amazing result for them to come 4th, two places above Reform UK in an election they didn't compete. 


  18. 3 hours ago, The Raptor said:

    Not going to get a discussion in their merits.  After a couple of incidents I've had they're worthless scum to me.

    I've not seen a single gull in Denmark. What a great place! 

    Of course, no surprise that a Raptor would have a dim view of gulls 😀

    • Haha 2

  19. 4 hours ago, Yellow Fever said:

    As before the real tangible threat to our democracy (ignoring external factors i.e. Russia) comes from the right and populists. Democracy rests on tolerance and inclusivity not a tyranny of an unthinking majority.

    You can see the age old recipe in action again today -.

    1. Take a period of economic difficulty to cause pain and discomfort especially to the poorer in society.

    2. Place the blame on some 'other'. Any easily identifiable group will do especially if they wear funny clothes and preferably foreigners. Today it's Muslims but it's been Jews, Romanies and the Irish in the past. Could even be those 'intellectuals'.

    3.Demonize them and rabble-rouse 

    4. Reinforce false narratives via a helpful controlled mass (and today social) media 

    5. Change the laws to make dissent ever more difficult. Neuter the courts. Those that protest label 'enemies of the people'.

    6. finally, welcome to an authoritarian state. 

    One only has to look as far as Trump to see where we are headed with the current right-wing populist nut jobs. If he wins will there be free and fair further elections in the US? Many are not convinced but by then far far too late.

     

    Spot on YF. You can see it happening in the UK as we speak. Goebbels wrote the manual, and Reform UK have digested every word. Take a (justifiably) discontented working class and harness their anger by identifying a suitable target for their vitriol. Immigrants are the classic choice, and so it is that Reform UK has focused upon them. However, they know that won't quite swing it for them in the current environment, so they have invented a nebulous version of the "Establishment" as a catchall to claim that they are the only alternative available. The irony of that is revealed by the briefest look at who Reform UK are.

    Reform UK is a private company owned by 3 directors; **** Tice, Nigel Farage, and Paul Oakden. They have complete control of the "party", with no formal input from the membership. They hire and fire who they wish, determine policy as they wish. All three are ex-public schoolboys. All three are very wealthy (especially Tice a multi-millionaire). Their last two by-election candidates were Ben Habib and Rupert Lowe. Both of those are ex-public schoolboys, both are multi-millionaires. Like Tice their considerable wealth has been significantly accumulated from the low-paid working class labour they employ.

    The stench of establishment in Reform UK is stronger than the stench of urine at a non-league football team's bogs. The idea that this establishment cabal has any interest in alleviating the plight of the poorly treated working classes is pure gaslighting at its most extreme. Their extremist far-right views saw them marginalised by the traditional parties and, as with the Na*zis in 1930s Germany, they recognised that their only route to power would be through manipulation and exploitation of the discontented working class.  Reform UK is nothing more than a front to serve the personal ambitions of a handful of privileged establishment men who have no compunction in exploiting working class discontent to achieve their lust for power. The divisive rhetoric they have to employ in achieving those ends is considered mere collateral damage to the people at the violent end of that language. Likewise the inevitable betrayal of the hopes they engendered in the discontented working class is also considered as just another necessary boardroom decision to exploit the human resources available. YF's simple schema captures very neatly the progress and aims of this bunch of populist grifters.

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