Hillhead

I can't judge others for using paywall extensions - I've not seen an ad on my browser for years 🙄

I see Swedens figures are being compared to their nordic neighbours and their decision not to lockdown being criticised. I have no idea of who's right and wrong, it's definitely not looking good in Sweden, but if the hospitals are not currently overwhelmed and the vaccine really is 12- 18 months away then will the deaths per million differences between the countries begin to converge? The virus isn't going away, and Swedens strategy seems to suggest they will reach herd immunity first?

In that situation we'd have another year of premier league income coming our way. Even if this seasons reduced by 25% (and didn't sky say something about not claiming it all back) we'd still be massively up when you consider next season.

With these paywall articles you can often be a bit sneaky and hit control A followed by Control C (command instead of control on Mac) and grab it before it brings up the paywall. I've never done such a thing but heard its possible.

57 Days between us winning the title at Villa and our first day back in training on 1st July, 70 days between that match and our first pre season friendly. Pre season usually lasts what? 5/6 weeks? There have been 40 days since we played Sheffield United. How long are these clubs going to need to get up to speed before getting back to playing again? With the increased pressure from clubs to get this done by 30th June and the lockdown to be extended. I think the games up.

How much is a league one club losing by not completing the season? Is it possible at all that a league one club completing the season BCD could actually be worse off than abandoning the season due to having to pay out match bonuses etc yet getting little to no match day income?

Ricardo you've long since pushed the null and void argument. At what point do you think we might start hearing noises that it's the accepted scenario? For me it's if the delay is long enough that you can no longer fit the full 2020/21 season in.

Same where I am, lots of Chinese students in my area and they've been wearing them for months. I think they will at least be strongly recommended by the time this lockdown ends.

I wonder if we will be wearing masks? New York State requiring masks now and Merkel recommending them in Germany, "It is recommended that masks be used in public transport and while shopping," Merkel told journalists after talks with regional leaders from Germany's 16 states. According to Germany's Ministry of Health, wearing even a simple face mask could shield others from infection, especially as some people with coronavirus are not aware that they have the disease.

https://www.skysports.com/football/news/11095/11973696/several-efl-clubs-days-away-from-going-bust-amid-wage-dispute

oof.

If the season can be completed in June/July and then next season takes place in full before the Euros then that of course is the option that I feel should be pursued. However I do query the following view "I am all for finishing this season, whenever that is. Even if it is not until Christmas, it should happen whenever it needs to, because doing that gives so much clarity for what happens next season - nothing has been decided yet." The issue with the above timeline is surely that will result in next season only having half the games? In that situation would clubs not be better off writing this season off and getting the full allocation next season. Especially league 1 and below whos income comes largely from gate receipts. i.e if you were to give a club like Bristol Rovers the option of either finishing their 4 home games this season then a half season of possibly just another 11 games next season Vs a full season that included 23 home games i'm sure they'd want the latter. If this runs into August there's going to come a point where it make more sense to prepare for a complete new season rather than prepare for the restart only to then have an end of season break - wasting 1 or 2 months where we could have been playing football so soon after coming back. Just to add - Bristol rovers have debts of £24Million and lost £3.4 Million last year, to them, everything counts.

if it turns out Norwich haven't lost out at all, let's say some scenario where the premierleague gets extended by 3 months and the PL decide to give out an extra 3 months of what the tv money would be worth (coming out of the PLs savings) I would honestly hope that Norwich do the right thing and hand the money back. If that (highly unlikely) situation doesn't come to pass I do think Norwich have done the right thing. You can't wait and see, you won't be able to rewind the clock and furlough.

I'm a bit confused here, I specifically said "much larger" and I'm also not stating that these companies shouldn't use it. So I'd like to know why you feel we shouldn't. Football is rather unique in that we knew about the vast increase we would be getting this season and just how drastically that would fall again should the worst happen next season. I feel we've been extremely conservative with our spend this season but even despite that it's not hard to see when you look at the balance sheet from last season we were never going to be flush with cash going forward. I have no idea of the current financial situation but I find it hard to criticise the clubs decision when it's pretty clear that with just how extreme the loss of money could be that we can go from being a club that was well set up for the future regardless of relegation to one that might be struggling because it doesn't have a rich owner to prop it out. I strongly think furloughing is the correct decision and justified - I'd be sorry to see staff out of jobs even a year or two down the line because the club didn't make use of the scheme available to it in response to a global pandemic. When Webber was asked about what promotion would mean for Norwich (back in 2017 I think) he said it would likely set us up for 20-30 year) I took that to mean it would allow for clearing of debts and structuring of the club to make it self sustainable - I know many on this forum don't want Delia here - but it is still his job to keep Norwich in as strong a position as possible. I feel my views have been consistent and I even remember you KC getting a bit tetchy with me when you were arguing that we should have made an extra £10 or so million available for player spending in the summer. I feel the club has been run in a resonsible manner and whilst it wouldn't be first in the queue of the furlough scheme, its got as much as right to it as any other of these major companies in my opinion.

"My God, you lot really don't like to be challenged do you?" - It's funny this is aimed at us instead of the guy jacking in his season ticket and leaving the forum because he couldn't accept not everyone agreed with his viewpoint. I don't have a problem with TVB posting what he posts - I disagree with some of it and find the arguments he uses to back up his claims lacking somewhat more often than not but have seen a lot of his posts on here as similar to the 'devils advocate' role. You're getting way ahead of yourself - TVB has declared he's no longer renewing his season ticket and won't be on the forum for a while - and people have responded telling him they really don't care - what responses did you expect from them exactly? it's an Internet forum. TVB has been one of the more aggressive posters on here the past few months and these are the expected results. If you and others disagree with the furlough decision that's fine. I personally, when I consider our owners wealth and way they run this club, find it hard to see why we shouldn't be using this option. If you disagree that's fine. Who has told you you can't challenge the clubs decision? All I've seen is repetitive posts and the same answers to them. Is that your idea of your views not being allowed - getting the same responses to the same questions? But before trying to tell us we have no principles sgncfc I do hope people like you are consistent whilst sat atop your moral high horse. I'd hate to think your wearing clothes made in a sweatshop, an iPhone (or one of many modern phones made in sweatshop style factories) and that you'll be steering clear of other, much larger companies than Norwich City who have also used the Furlough scheme.

I'm just going on what he wrote on twitter. "I wasn’t aware that he had announced it first. But surely a conversation between the club and the player to say “look let’s not announce this at the moment as it’s not the right time”. Wouldn’t have been too difficult to arrange?" and in response to someone suggesting the deal was done in January "Yes it means they have to go ahead with the deal. I just feel it shouldn’t have been announced now that’s all" Also I think hes been a bit naughty with this comment that the pinkun have published "While you're furloughing staff, adding a new player to the wage bill is not a great look." This is unlikely to be correct surely? He won't be joining us until whenever the new season starts.

25% wage deferral for April being proposed for league 1 and 2. Will it be enough? https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/52285552

No he doesn't. He feels the transfer should have gone through just not been announced yet. Even then it seems it was Sanini who got there first.

Thats the whole point though, the benefit from masks may well be so minimal that it's better for people not to have them and stay inside than go out with them. But as with your analogy, that doesn't stop any potential benefit from existing otherwise and thats what we need to think about. The virus may well not be 'airborne' but it still can be spread up to 1m after a cough or sneeze. If the masks do reduce that range you could make a case for them being mandatory in supermarkets etc? As for the cycle helmet example there is much evidence out there proving their safety regarding head injuries. Whether you want to argue they cause kids / wreckless people to take further risk and sustain injuries they wouldn't have otherwise is irrelevant to your average commuter who's behaviour would otherwise be unchanged.

I read the review you yourself posted. Have you?

Agreed. It seems accepted that the masks do a job in stopping an infected person spreading the disease. With so many people having it unknowingly I think the wearing of masks will be with us for a long time. It also seems the main reasons for not recommending them is the need to prioritise them for hospitals etc and the false sense of security they give to the public who may feel they are protected and neglect other hygiene procedures.

I don't know enough about the masks but would this not be evidence of the latter - seeing how it's primarily spread through coughs and sneezes?

They supposedly have 1.5B in cash reserves. As for the furloughing decision, if decisions are made by the PL to cover clubs so that Norwich have ultimately received roughly the money it expected to receive this season and not incurred extra losses due to the covering of the extended wage payments. Then I would hope to see Norwich not take up the option of collecting the money, they would be in a rather unique position of having not lost out in this situation. That won't call into question the decision to have made the initial claim though, not in my eyes.

Understood, and on your poll I did vote for a 30%+ wage deferral / reduction. But regardless of where the money comes from, do you not think the premier league could/would make this payment to it's clubs instead of sky? I was thinking about this the other day, let's say we were to just 'extend' the season by 3 months. Would the premier league be able/willing to step in and pay its clubs the whatever the expected income is during that period, effectively extending the season both in terms of duration and total income - the later by necessity. I know in the championship they earn about £7M a season (regardless of finishing position) plus about £100k for every home game, would it be possible to give each club an extra £1.75m for a season extended by 3 months? And while this might not help the balance sheets for those that run at a loss (Leeds, Derby) what else could you do? I accept there may be a hundred reasons why the above could well be a non starter, it's just one of the scenarios that popped into my head.

I won't pretend to have any knowledge in the field, but I highly doubt this could be possible (parachute payments being lost), the league are already trying desperately not to lose the money due this season, how could it just right write off what it has promised clubs like ourselves that might soon be due the parachute payments, with £1.5 billion in cash reserves, I think we will get them. Unless you just meant they would be delayed as with the new season - which I agree would be expected, but that raises another question - I've seen people speculating that this season will be extended and contracts simply extended across the board, but how does that sit with clubs such as Norwich who may have wage reductions in our contracts to suit our new division, to simply tell us we are going to be paying our premier league wages for longer with no extra income. I don't think it's going to be easy.