kantata soul

[quote user="Indy_Bones"][quote user="kantata soul"]But playing in such a way meant that we couldn''t hope to finish any higher than midtable. Instead of pushing on and improving our game with a decent manager and coaches we tried to consolidate by going negative. We are still paying the price for failing to be more ambitious.[/quote]No offence, but that''s a ridiculous statement.We simply do not have the financial backing to push any further than midtable safety in the prem, you only have to look at the spending (and squad quality) of the clubs currently in the top 8 positions to realise that we were already punching above our weight in our places with both Lambert and Hughton:Arsenal - 95 milChelsea - 118 milMan City - 87.5 milMan Utd - 145.4 milSpurs - 28 milSouthampton - 68 milWest Ham - 29 milLiverpool - 117 milOut of those, despite Spurs relatively low spend this season, they had already spent 165 mil over the previous 2 seasons and therefore had a good squad to begin with. In fact, the only club in there that we could arguably compete with is West Ham, and whilst they''re not paying a lot in transfer fees I do hear that they''re paying some pretty impressive wages instead (the likes of Carroll, Jarvis and Song are on an absolute fortune IIRC).So tell me again exactly HOW you expected us to push on and improve on our previous 11/12th place finishes without spending probably close to 50-60 mil to take us beyond the other teams around us who would all have been spending 20-25 mil themselves anyway???[/quote]I''m looking a bit longer term than you seem to be. We''re in the Championship and haven''t had a decent run in the top division for well over 20 years now. As a result we''ve missed out on the premiership money and have largely failed to invest in the club. Currently we''re struggling to get out of the second tier after having realised that there are actually teams in the division that are better than us.There are lots of little old Norwich fans who have a very narrow short term view and scoff at the idea that we can finish higher than 11th or 12th. If we were properly run then I can''t see why we couldn''t have a sustained period in the premiership with a view to pushing on further than our last visit. I never said it would be immediate. If we had made wiser choices 15-20 years ago then we might by now be sitting in a 30-35k stadium watching decent football and expecting to survive with a bigger budget than we have had recently. A top four finish is probably beyond us, but the aim should be to try and finish in the upper half (West Brom recently managed 8th). With all due respect your mindset is typical of many fans who seem to think that we are in a fixed position within the footballing order. I don''t think it''s ridiculous to say that there''s room for improvement and we have to start somewhere if we want to achieve it. We won''t get anywhere if we constantly go down the low quality football route trying to compete with two dozen other teams who''re trying to do the same, especially ones which have better financial backing. It''s similar in something like manufacturing where it''s almost impossible to compete with countries like China in selling low quality products. To survive firms need to compete at the high quality end of the market.Swansea are the obvious template for what''s needed, over several years they have planned around playing good quality football instead of trying to scrap their way to survival each year. As a result they are in a stable position, have just made a decent profit from selling Bony and are now able to grow the club. They haven''t really been in serious danger of relegation or been massively affected by a change of manager. In fact I would think that sooner or later they will develop a team which will finish a couple of places higher than their previous record of 9th. They haven''t spent their way to success but have aimed to appoint managers who commit to playing high quality football.This contrasts markedly with Norwich which has had no footballing ethos and has been a revolving door with players, managers and coaches coming and going, playing style changing and hence has had little stability. Swansea would not have touched someone like Hughton with a barge pole and allow their playing style to be compromised, but they have allowed Gary Monk to be a little more direct than his predecessors. Would we have matched or bettered Swansea if Lambert had stayed? I very much doubt it. After a generation of chopping and changing and accepting poor quality we''re roughly where we would expect to be given the increasing money in the game.It''s not 100% about budget, although that is obviously a significant determinant. But to be able to compete, and maximise our budget for doing so, we need to be run more along the lines of Swansea instead of having football-illiterate people making the decisions.If we could finish 11th or 12th by knocking the ball up for a big striker to head in, then we ought to be able to finish higher by played something more sophisticated. Higher quality would certainly be a prerequisite for a higher finish. If we focused on this aim then we''d have a better chance of staying in the top division and over time being able to grow the club, eventually surpassing our previous mid table finishes.

Lambert took us as far as he could considering the football we played under him was basically whacking the ball into the box for Holt or Morison to head in. Two good headers of the ball plus some decent midfielders like Fox, Surman and Hoolahan meant that we could play that system very well and continue the momentum.But playing in such a way meant that we couldn''t hope to finish any higher than midtable. Instead of pushing on and improving our game with a decent manager and coaches we tried to consolidate by going negative. We are still paying the price for failing to be more ambitious.

Lambert was good, but nothing beats finishing 3rd in the 1992-93 season and those UEFA Cup nights under Walker. The irony is that we were one win short of finishing 2nd above Villa.

We cannot afford to drop many points due to the teams above us generally being superior. We need to somehow get better results in order to overtake them. Therefore 10 points is a minimum otherwise the pressure will increase as we start running out of games.

Alex Neil confronts Olsson right at the end of the highlights video - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KpaFcofq6go

[quote user="morty"][quote user="kantata soul"][quote user="morty"]We really could do with another, good quality, midfielder in on loan. Or get Andreu up to speed / Vadis fit. We need solid options to close games out.[/quote]Yep, midfield is still the problem area. We need to be able to hold onto the ball in order to soak up pressure just as much as we need to be able to attack. At the moment the only real improvement we''ve seen is being a bit more organised and a bit tighter.I can''t fault the need to tighten up in order to try and squeeze into the playoffs, but longer term we''ll need a lot more than that. My fear is that Alex Neil doesn''t have the ability to produce what''s required.[/quote]And one of the main issues is that we seem to have players that are unable to do both, its either one, or the other.The closest thing we have had to a dominant midfielder in recent times is Fer, and he was far from perfect.[/quote]Fer certainly had that ability, but the hardest bit is being able to get the whole team to hold onto the ball. We''ve often been found wanting when the ball goes backwards but gets knocked long instead of getting passed forwards again.

[quote user="morty"]We really could do with another, good quality, midfielder in on loan. Or get Andreu up to speed / Vadis fit. We need solid options to close games out.[/quote]Yep, midfield is still the problem area. We need to be able to hold onto the ball in order to soak up pressure just as much as we need to be able to attack. At the moment the only real improvement we''ve seen is being a bit more organised and a bit tighter.I can''t fault the need to tighten up in order to try and squeeze into the playoffs, but longer term we''ll need a lot more than that. My fear is that Alex Neil doesn''t have the ability to produce what''s required.

[quote user="Phillip J Fry"]Norwich clearly have the ability to break down any side in this division[/quote]This is a bit of a myth as we don''t have the variety or a strong enough midfield. More often than not we''ve ended up whacking the ball into the box because we lack the ability to penetrate defences. If we can''t come to a sh!tho1e like this and teach them a footballing lesson then we don''t deserve to be promoted.

[quote user="morty"][quote user="kantata soul"][quote user="morty"][quote user="kantata soul"]I could never understand why people were raving about him.[/quote]He scored some great goals when part of the youth set up.[/quote]That might be true, but some people were touting him for a first team start. He''s not really shown enough to warrant that in my opinion.[/quote] Agree[Y]Maybe we shouldn''t be writing him off just yet though?[/quote]Too soon. Look at the abuse Harry Kane got from the football experts on here when he was at Norwich on loan.

[quote user="morty"][quote user="kantata soul"]I could never understand why people were raving about him.[/quote]He scored some great goals when part of the youth set up.[/quote]That might be true, but some people were touting him for a first team start. He''s not really shown enough to warrant that in my opinion.

Indy_Bones has nailed it. Millions come in from foreign sales of TV rights but fans are still ripped off through higher ticket prices, overpriced shirts etc. You used to be able to watch live games on terrestrial tv, but even these have disappeared as football has turned into a money machine.

I could never understand why people were raving about him.

[quote user="chicken"]I don''t think it was an illusion at all.Financially it was more competetive so therefore success bread success. Finishing higher up the league meant Europe which meant you could attract a better caliber of player.Take Man City now for example. The assembled a squad of highly paid top level players before they even qualified for the Champions League. In fact they went a couple of seasons without finishing high enough.From 1980-91/92 Liverpool won the title 6 times. Everton and Arsenal twice each, Aston Villa and Leeds once each. You go back to the ''70''s and it becomes even more diverse in terms of number of teams winning it.http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_English_football_champions1970-79: Liverpool 4 titles, Derby 2, Derby 2 titles. Arsenal, Nottingham Forrest and Leeds all with 1 title each.And that''s just the winners - the list of runners up is even more varied. The likes of Watford, that scarcely supported team down the road, Southampton, Villa, Man Utd, Man City, QPR.In terms of the premier league, there has only ever been 5 different club winners. Man Utd, Arsenal, Chelsea, Man City and the single time Blackburn won it. I think it is fair to say that Blackburn had to spend heavy that season to win the title. The runners up list is not as varied either. Aston Villa in the first prem season and then Newcastle a couple of times early on too. [/quote]I agree with a lot of this. The early Premier League was far better because it was generally more even. The quality aspect is a double edged sword ie more of the best in the world drawn to a few of the top clubs, but more teams playing poor quality survival football just to stay in the division.The money has led to an overall lazy attitude towards development and playing style, and only a few teams have tried to play football once they have been promoted. A lot of neutrals are blasé about watching Prem games because the lack of competition has led to it becoming stale. The FA Cup suffered a similar fate.

I hope this shuts up all the Norwich ''fans'' who wanted McCarthy as Norwich manager.

A competent performance against a very poor side. Some good goals but overall not much to get excited about. It''s a shame almost all the teams above us won.

A bit of sporadic booing early in the game. Crowd is more muted since we scored.

The score is flattering us. Blackpool are not offering much but neither are we.

2-1 to Blackpool.

[quote user="chicken"]What?!! You mean like going on and on and on and on and on about spending £17.2million in the summer and that it''s all Delia and MWJ''s fault that we are skint -again- ?[/quote]We''re outside the playoffs with an inexperienced third rate manager leading a poor squad. This is after having been relegated last summer and giving the job to the U18s boss. It''s Delia and MWJ''s fault full stop that we''re in this mess to begin.

Don''t worry. There will inevitably be a rousing Duncan Edwards blog post to gloss over the lack of transfer action and cheer up the doubters.

[quote user="Maccys Back"]P.O nail on head with that one, the far more intelligent on here will now state rubbish like " we don''t need anyone" blah blah blah. Its norwich pre Lambert all over again! This penny pinching is why he left in the end and to top it off they then tried pinching his bonus money he was due. Seems the ones who know football can really see what this joke board are all about (Phelan, Lambert, Joe Royale)[/quote]It''s not the first time the board have failed to back the manager in the January window, so you''ve got to wonder if they actually trust their new manager to spend on players.They''ve had a go at a couple of players, of which we got the easy to get one (ie Andreu), but maybe they''re waiting to see how Neil performs with what he''s got between now and the summer. If things go t1ts up then maybe a proper manager will arrive in June and get a bigger kitty.

[quote user="chicken"]I don''t blame Olsson.West Brom are just three points off the relegation spots. A player that has suffered two relegations already probably understands their position as well as any. You can understand him wanting a release clause if - otherwise he could be in exactly the same position again come next January.[/quote]That''s not exactly a vote of confidence in WBA''s manager. I should think Pulis is breathing a sigh of relief but we''re now lumbered with a lazy player who has a bad attitude.

Olsson is lazy and has a bad attitude so it''s a shame we didn''t manage to get rid of him. He was at fault for Brentford''s goal but our fans instead singled out Whittaker for criticism, someone who at least tries hard. Olsson should now be made to train with the youth team.

I''ll be willing to give the new lad a chance. But I''ll be less accepting of the new manager and his sidekick who haven''t earned the right to take on the task of reviving Norwich City.

Any plans or expectations for this season have been well and truly ripped up. Therefore it seems at the moment like we''re reduced to crossing our fingers hoping for the best.