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Oh give it a rest.

Man wears suit, morons triggered. More at 11.

Sure is.

It's precisely why Socrates distinguished knowledge (of) from wisdom (about). In Plato's Apology Socrates explains to a court why he encouraged young people to think for themselves rather than simply accept the professed wisdom of those who claimed to have superior knowledge, such as Athenian politicians. He explains that his reputation for being the wisest man in Athens rested on one piece of knowledge alone; that he knows he doesn't know anything. Wisdom, he says, consists in recognition of one's own ignorance. If one recognises that fundamental truth one will always need to keep an open mind and engage in critical enquiry every day of one's life. Socrates, of course, knew many things (that he was human, an Athenian, a man etc, etc) but recognised that wisdom consisted in being prepared to question the significance or meaning of those pieces of knowledge. His role, he thought, was not to tell the youth of Athens what to think, but to act like a midwife and help them give birth to their own understanding. Needless to say the authorities found him guilty of corrupting the youth of Athens and put him to death. Several centuries later the greatest philosopher of the modern era, Immanuel Kant, proclaimed that the most profound intellectual and social change in the history of Western culture, the Enlightenment, was best best summed up by the motto "Sapere Aude" (variously translated as "dare to think", "dare to be wise", "have the courage to think for yourself"). So, one of the most knowledgeable men in the world at that time described Enlightenment not as the accumulation of facts, but the development of the ability and will to think for oneself. When I was lecturing I used to do outreach in schools to encourage children from less advantaged backgrounds to consider continuing into further education. I would begin with the simple question regarding what the thought was the point of education. Of course they responded with the expected replies that it was about "learning stuff/facts", about "getting a good job" etc. Essentially, a standard (not wrong) means/end rationality for enduring the process of education. However, the minute we began to discuss the thoughts of Socrates, Kant, Descartes etc about education being more fundamentally concerned with their own personal development, about becoming an individual able to think for themself, there would typically be a quite remarkable transformation in the class dynamic and engagement. Learning stuff then becomes not just a boring necessity to pass exams, but a means by which each individual develops their ability to think for themself, a source of self-respect and sense of transformative personal power. Feedback from the children and teachers from these sessions remain a source of pride (and I really don't care who wants to accuse me of egotistical self-satisfaction). Cleverness will vary, but all possess the power to think for themselves and it should be the primary function of an education system to enable each individual to develop that ability to fulness of their potential. Perhaps the fundamental point I'm driving at here is that developing the willingness to learn is as important (if not more important) as developing cleverness (be that measured by IQ or otherwise). I think it a major failing of our modern education system that children do not have the will to learn placed at the centre of their engagement with the knowledge they are taught. An education system that does not engage the will of all the students in a common project of personal self-development is an education system that ensures a divide between those who are able to display their cleverness from those who feel alienated by their "failure" to be clever. Perhaps we shouldn't then be surprised that we end up with the sort of divisive and entrenched disagreement evidenced by the Brexit vote and its aftermath.

I actually can’t argue with that

Reminds me of

https://video.leedsunited.com/video/dm9kJTdDMF9nMXBmM2pwNCU3QyUyRnBhZ2UlM0ZzbHVnJTNEaG9tZSU3Q2hvbWUlMkZsaXN0JTJGMCUyRmZlZWQ%3D for those who want to watch the whole game https://video.leedsunited.com/video/dm9kJTdDMF9oZTFnNGxpOSU3QyUyRnBhZ2UlM0ZzbHVnJTNEaG9tZSU3Q2hvbWUlMkZsaXN0JTJGMCUyRmZlZWQ%3D and Cameron Jerome has joined Bolton, hopefully to stick a goal or two past the binners

Can't see too much consensus. Even for an idealist like me. Labour has been talking up making Brexit 'work' and Starmer has been very cautious. We've discussed why on many occasions on threads here. There is little pro reunion talk apart from pro EU interest groups. The ERG still appear to have Sunak mostly in their pocket - he isn't able to unite his party. We have leaders of both parties being partially weak. Starmer doesn't want to alienate his base either. The Tories will lose power in 2024. Could be sooner if there are more serious events that emerge undermining this most appalling political period in our times. Maybe in 5 years Labour might approach? Then, there's the EU themselves. Why on earth would they want us back? They will have reorganised all their infrastructures and arrangements 'sans' the UK. They will have moved on (and forward). Not that the EU hasn't it's own problems and challenges ahead. To accept a UK back at the table they would have had to have witnessed and worked alongside many years of a serious UK government - not watching on from the sides an appalling and shambolic husk of an administration that we see virtually on a day to day basis. I wouldn't want to get involved with much to do with the UK at the moment. Toxic. Brexit has damaged trust and our reputation. That kind of thing needs years to repair. The 52% vote really has done that much damage. It's all in Cameron's court aided and abetted by some of the worst Tory politicians who've seen Brexit as a coat hook on which to hang their personal ambitions. I don't share the hopefulness of that article. Though I would dearly love to.

Exactly. Will the Tory Government ever look beyond the old Bank Manager lifestyle? How many retirees are going to go and work in a totally different vocation on less money than their final salary pension and then pay even more tax? If they are talking about getting the workforce back to levels required they need to admit Brexit is a flop rather than talk about the bonus of it.

Can someone explain, how he moves between spots?

That was after years and years of Jason Lee asking for an apology and being met with silence.

A major problem with the British publics understanding of the issues of the day is the standard of journalism. Not just the spin that we have come to expect, but also that the journalists and columnists themselves seem to display a poor grasp on the subjects they are writing about (possibly, even if they haven't) Exhibit 1, below, from the Daily Mail Can you solve this dragon's den contestant's equation? I certainly couldn't solve it, despite having passed maths A level. Simply because it isn't a fúcking equation. It should be pretty obvious to anyone its not an equation, even if they don't recognize it as the notation to the opening of The Queen's Gambit I don't know what the journalist/sub-editor is trying to convey with this headline, maybe they see letters and numbers together and think the reader will relate to the word "equation" without thinking any further. Maybe they think it is some kind of alphanumeric alliteration Personally, I think it's ignorant

Well it says Brexit in it so I can sumerise the post is full of rubbish, false promises, lies and garbage.

Been seeing the ads for the Fantasy Football League show with Matt Lucas when watching matches, and it got me reminiscing about the Baddiel and Skinner original. So starting watching a few of them after Forest vs Man Utd match last night. ...Second episode in and Delia showed up on S02E02 here if anyone wants to watch: Quite interesting to see her discussing the club when she was just a fan, and her remarks about us getting it wrong about Robert Chase.. I can't even remember her being out-spoken on him at the time, anyone else? (Around 11 minute mark she talks) Great show, anyway... And she was pretty sassy back then too! 🙂

A short, terse summary in the school magazine for former pupils was as follows: "You don't go to school to learn maths, algebra, physics, etc. You go to school to learn how to learn. Master that, and you can teach yourself almost anything". And if there is a fundamental problem in our education system, it's micromanagement to the n-th degree such that pupils are coached to pass exams and not to engage in depth with the topic matter.

Ten Hag brought him in as a half way translator

Maybe he learned the same as Vincent Kompany, that its a special stadium, and home to a pretty decent football team these days as well. “Whatever camera angles you guys have, they don’t do it justice, it’s bigger than that when you come in,” he said. “I’ve travelled all over England, but it’s a special place, for sure" https://www.twtd.co.uk/ipswich-town-news/44265/kompany-portman-roads-a-special-place Don't worry though, i'm sure Vincent will be equally as glowing about fortress Carrot road, when he visits you next week!

That's the sort of comment only a brexiter would come out with. Get him boys.

No longer a Norwich player, move on

Rangers 2-0

Brilliant 👏 stuff. Having been out of the UK 🇬🇧 a long time now. DO they make anything similar or are we so politically correct and a bunch of snowflakes now. That was a great watch. And for the purists deary me even Delia I'm sure liked it. Delia was very nice on the eye when I was a younger lad. 💥🤫😉

Good luck to him. Though he does look like your stoner cousin who is forced to wear a suit to your sister's wedding.

To be fair if you had such luxury hair like Todd you’d be posing too. I’m guessing not though 😁

It's an odd quirk of football fandom, this. Because a great many Norwich fans hold that Cantwell was given a much rougher time of it- and much less patience- simply because he was 'one of our own' from the next town over. I've actually used Gilmour as an example of a player that attracted quite vicious feedback from fans, didn't look up to it for us (whether or not that was down to player or role notwithstanding) but never hid & was selected whenever fit. Personally I feel with Todd it was a bit backwards, that it *seemed* like he was given less patience but only because it was *assumed* that because he's local he should get extra. I don't feel Cantwell was any worse treated than others in the past few years. Furthermore whilst thinking about this, in the Athletic piece on TC it is suggested the player/agent felt his game was much more suited away from the rustle-bustle of the Championship and would would thrive in the PL. Yet we have a recent example in Gilmour, who obviously has technical ability, utterly wilting from the pace + power of that league. Perspectives are peculiar things.

You say "shocking ability" but he was essentially a Cameron Jerome, and don't think you'd be as forgiving if some TV presenters did this to Cameron Jerome whilst he was at Norwich. That you would defend blackface says all I need to know about you so you can have the final word.

Oy loiked Faarrrka much more than Vaaarggna......now he was orseome, that fella. That Vaaarrgna boiee, he have a lot to prove, he do.

Pragmatism tells me we will never be a part of the EU again. Despite the mantra of equality, we all know that we could not face being junior partners to Germany and France. We will never join the Euro. So we have to find common ground in the UK for what we can achieve in terms of a relationship with our neighbours. If us remainers can accept we won't be back in the EU and the Leavers can accept that we have to live with and trade with the Worlds biggest single market, then we have a template for forging ahead and getting back to normal.

Losing 0-1 at half time H Follow here: https://www.scorebar.com/team/19151/fomget-gsk-women

yep...as well as working as delivery drivers (supermarkets, Amazon etc) to pay the electric bills. Thinking of folk being on a golf course (and similar) is such a crass statement reeking of the class system too. It was Osborne and Cameron whose austerity (directly in my case) made people redundant when they were previously very actively engaged in trying ameliorate the worst aspects of government policy on those least able to withstand it. Those who worked in the charitable, public and third sectors would tell you too. And now we have Hunt about to install a fresh round of austerity. No wonder over the decade, our public services have crumbled, with parts of society with it. I'm sure he has a softer side and has to say these kinds of things to attempt to influence. The state of our public services, our care system, the shortage of labour though is a matter of record. Brexit has been a negative at the heart of many things.

I have nothing against religion but as far as I am concerned it was manufactured by humanity.

I signed in just a moment and saw your reply H. So, I wanted to applaud your piece. I think you've touched on such an important thing - that the journey, the process of finding out something is a joy and an interest in itself. That you can have this curiosity I believe, will serve you well enough. I ought to make some (quite) personal references here and say that for me being curious does have a double-edged side to it. That's because you so often question yourself too! Well, when i say 'you' I certainly mean 'me'. Only yesterday, a friend called over and in a brief part of our conversation (on where time goes!) I mentioned that I had very little self to speak of when I had thought about it! A weird statement but I tried to explain that I felt I had always been rather a blank piece of paper - or maybe blotting paper would have been more apt a description? I have not known a lot of stuff and life just slowly 'writes on the blank piece of paper'. You'd think then that the paper would be full but actually what tends to happen for me is that the next day it is quite a plain piece of paper again! It is a deliberate act - call it curiosity or a real annoyance that I don't want any tying of myself to any mast! I don't wish to be tainted (not quite the right word - perhaps that should be over-influenced) with a fixed position. Fixed life positions are not helpful in my understanding (over the years). The world doesn't really care and has ways to upset the apple cart. Therefore, one needs to be nimble as possible. I think I have been drawn to Sartre's existentialist world (Nausea is one of my favourite books - world changing because it speaks of the sheer 'thingyness' of life but also hints at what one might do as well). So, I tend to observe and absorb and process. But, like so many posters on this forum I don't then really have a strongly held point of view - on much at all! It has worried me but also it helps me being freer (the double edged sword again!). It's why sometimes it's only over the length of a post that I will work out, through the writing, what I actually think. It's why I posted that I may be rather dim (whatever my IQ scores say). My ability to simply logically lay out sides of an argument is weak. That's because I hold different views up in the air often at the same time and I suspend belief / suspend decision a lot of the time. I often end up with loads of patterns (best way of describing it) which takes me a while to work out. My values are still there (about unfairness, kindness, loyalty, friendship, equality etc etc) but I tend not to dislike anybody! It is very strange. I dislike certain things people say and the ways some people act but I still think I could find things I liked too if I was ever in the position to be alongside them. Anyway, I'm veering towards a stream of consciousness essay again in responding to your sentence about willingness to learn 😅 so don't wish to be a bore. Being alive and working out who one is, how to be happy etc is a bloomin' battle (using one of Raymond Briggs' terms). Any help that teachers, lecturers, mentors, good supervisors etc can give in helping us all, especially when we are young, to conjure with these ideas would be enormously helpful. I think I've just had to work it all out myself but so wish I hadn't felt as stupid - or rather 'at sea' with not knowing HOW to try and look at the world when growing up. I'm an (older) man now but really, I'm probably still the little boy who wonders about things. The biggest question of all, as one ages, is knowing what bloody use one is to anyone else! And that's my current predicament, finding a purpose after my active fathering and careers have ended. I think I might speak for many others?

And now the government is so desperate to remedy the post-Brexit labour shortage without resorting to immigration that it's using financial and emotional blackmail on early retirees. It depicts them as 'on the golfcourse' when an increasing number in their late 50s/early 60s are looking after grandchildren so that their children can work, and/or providing care for their parents to keep them out of retirement homes, thus saving the government billions.

Chuck Norris' tears can heal the sick. It's just a shame he never cries... ever.

Singles & doubles titles for Alfie. 😀

Ronnie F*cking PICKERING!!

I'm sure the GFPA will be along to dissect this shortly, but I'm guessing this is to enable the Attanasios to take a larger share in the club? https://www.canaries.co.uk/content/club-issue-notice-of-general-meeting

I know its early Sweary , but I agree 100 %. There's a lot more post interviews and he speaks very well balanced , humble and a guy with a mission. WTF has been going on at this end of the country.

Ah bless, don't worry you guys will get a star on your shirts one day, when you win something...........which i'm sure you will, one day

Fingers crossed 🤞

That’s interesting. How does one become one of the Pink Un intelligentsia? Or if you need to ask does that exclude you? (Bonus points if you are quoting Groucho Marx to yourself at this point). I can think of a few strong candidates. I’m imagining a Venn diagram to be made of the Usual Suspects, Guild of Fag Packet Accountants, Inner Circle, Intelligentsia, Delia Apologists, Cook Outers… the list goes on.

Hoffenheim BTTS. I knew a Farke defence wouldn't let me down...😍

Realised he is not quite as good as as Wes ... ?

I bet that is the first time he has ever worn a shirt and tie in his life. 😜

Looks like a 12 year old wearing his dads clothes.Seriously though will be interesting seeing how he does

Great opportunity for Webber to quit 👍

I don't care what anyone says, this show was brilliant. Does anyone remember the Saints and Greavsie mini-series they did that replaced "Phoenix from the Flames" for a few weeks, and Mike Walker starred in it? It was after he'd been sacked by Everton.

What intelligence means is very interesting. I saw a programme about Wayne Rooney that included an interview with someone who had coached Rooney when he was 11. The coach was fascinated by his ability and at one point stopped him on the halfway line and put his hand over Rooney's eyes. Rooney was able to tell him where everyone on the pitch was and where they were going. He went on to explain his options with the ball based on the varying abilities of all the other players and where they were. The coach said he'd never seen anything like it from an adult let alone an eleven year old. He described him as a genius even though at that time Rooney couldn't read or write very well. It seems that IQ is very limited in what it can tell us about someone. During my working life I got to meet a huge number of owners of medium size businesses. Those sort of people employ approaching 30% of the working population. As an ice breaker I used to ask them about their personal history and history of their businesses, most of which had started from scratch. The number of people who replied that they had left school with little or no qualifications was extraordinary. One of them even told me that it was a good job he was thick because he was too stupid to realise the financial risks he had taken. It would seem that a high IQ is no guarantee of success or happiness.