Leaderboard

Where did it all go wrong Daniel, Stuart, Delia? I had a client who - aside from other things - was a leading National risk assessor for Health & Safety accidents at work. When thinking about apportioning blame for any perceived failure, I often think about his firmly-held belief - borne of repeated experience - that major failures are almost always the consequence of a string of (he would say predominantly-avoidable) smaller errors occurring in collective sequence. These errors can be broken down into the strategic, the operational-systemic and the individual. The overriding driver for assessment is learning and structural improvement where necessary. Much as it is with Norwich. In the immediate aftermath of failure, my client would consider it highly unwise to leap to find fast answers and apportion useful blame. It is something of a human instinct, though it is a poor substitute for slower, more considered thinking. Norwich don’t have enough money to compete on an equal footing at this level. This is undoubtedly a massive hindrance and defines a number of macro imperatives that drive subsequent sporting decisions. Let’s start with the obvious. There are few Norwich fans who would argue against the statement that Buendia was our best player last year and that Skipp was our most important. Buendia for pure ability to hurt the opposition and affect games, week in, week out. He cannot be ignored strategically by the opposition, they have to change their own preferred plans to adjust to his very presence. Coaching definition: a weapon. Skipp naturally played the exact way that offered a key counterpoint to the way Farke likes to play and set up his sides. He instinctively acted as a third centre back when necessary, didn’t get sucked forward or out of shape when we were on top, smelt danger before it arrives and was fast into the fire at its outbreak. If he was not priceless to us, his role was. If not him, then someone had to bought to do that exact job. It is even more important at the top level. This is not hindsight, it was pretty clear to the vast majority of Norwich fans who watch their team regularly. Let us now shoot a canard or two to move the discussion forward. It is unheard of to sell your best player and major weapon upon promotion. Unheard of. The timing of it is extraordinary. It was a huge gamble and - slightly - smells of a compulsive need-belief in ‘doing differently’ to the point where you try to reinvent the wheel in evangelical belief. Norwich did not have to sell Buendia. There have been thousands of footballers who pitched for a move, who got their agent to get spiky, who leaked some ‘come-and-get-me’ pleas, a thousand gentleman’s agreements in football that weren’t worth the toilet paper they weren’t wiped on. Norwich were premier League. Buendia was under contract. Promotion was fresh. Norwich chose to sell Buendia. This goes to the heart of the issue, as it combines the weaknesses of lack of finance with sporting strategy. It is not retrospective wisdom to note that at the top level teams are full of powerful, capable squads who have the top level nous to minimise on-field strategic weakness (and force the best to be brilliant, week-in, week-out). Weaker teams face more pressure and thus weaker players make more individual mistakes. Is this then really errors of the individual or the inevitable odds of the wheel of fortune? Stuart Webber wisely stated that we would not try to compete with this, that we couldn’t, that we would focus on improving the first xi and not spread money around a vast squad of interchangeable (likely not-quite-as-good-as-everyone-else’s) players. Nevertheless the decision was made to sell Buendia - who not only a weapon in his own right, but also ensured that Pukki his compadre was at least half a weapon. That’s already good enough to trouble teams a bit. What has been bought are not weapons. They are good players. We are on average much better as a squad, yet conversely less dangerous to the opposition. There is the trade. It seems at odds with the early-in-pre-season statement. Daniel Farke can pick two good teams every week, though not an eleven that can trouble the opposition. This looks like an expensive mis-calculation. There may be a necessary asset investment angle to this. A Tzolis, a Sargent, a Rashica can flourish and suddenly be a valuable asset. They may stay and thrive in the Championship. This strategy may be a product of lack of finance. It would be hard to argue that it doesn’t sacrifice the here-and-now though. The painful truth may be that Daniel, Stuart and Delia have all done as well as they can with what they have. Demanding change now may be missing the point. Daniel may be wedded to a dominant footballing philosophy that flourishes exclusively against the weaker. Stuart may have ‘done different’ one too many times and succumbed to the - often wonderful - religious fervour of a new Messiah. Delia may be right to rail against the dreadful capitalism of the whole thing….but…. …Maths is a terrible adversary however and all the numbers are against us with what we have. Unpicking the stitching in the dugout changes little if the over-arching fundamentals remain the same. Farke may be the lightning rod, Webber may seek pastures new and trade off well-earned previous glories, Delia may cling on with an ever-tighter grip like Miss Haversham in the crumbling manor…but what then? Does the cycle repeat….the wonderful, awful pain and joy of yo-yo greatness and awfulness? The railing against Murdoch’s millions while gobbling it up so it can be dribbled away to pay for the inevitable annual millions lost in the Championship? Farke has an array of good players, though he has no weapons. Even Pukki is emasculated without Buendia. Of course when you have one or two weapons you are dependent. Of course you are one injury away from a real issue. Though even that wily old warhorse Steve Bruce - no-ones favourite for favourite manager of the year - essentially builds a solid, effective team then ‘gives the ball to the lad Saint-Maximin’ while the others players sit tight, watch and applaud. It is an effective strategy for the job at hand. Newcastle stay up comfortably (also not enough for fans of course, one must ever move forwards..such is top level sport). Unless you are a truly wealthy, incredible team you cannot hold many weapons for long though. Though the magpies do keep Saint-Maximin, Spurs do not sell Kane and nobody - but nobody - sells such a weapon at the point of promotion. Norwich are hamstrung by their ownership model. Self-sustaining to an absolutist degree is an extraordinary strategy in football. There is no money. Self-sustaining is not a philosophy or a laudable guiding principle, it is borne of necessity. Everything - selling Buendia included - flows from there. Unless Delia gives the shares away or bequeathes them to a group or individual, then they must be bought. They do have a value. Let us say that the club is worth £100m. To buy 65% of the club, an investor, new benefactor, lottery winner must spend £65m on a nameplate. Before anything else happens. £65m spent and not a single loan left back added yet. No wonder there ‘is no queue of investors lining Carrow Road’. So this is it. This is where the maths ends up and the road we tread again. Farke is a red herring. Sacking the manager changes nothing. I’m not even sure that 2 or 3 ardent fans would agree on what our best xi is, what shape it should be, where our best weapons are. I’m afraid simply railing that ‘we should get after them more’….or ‘we don’t go at teams from the off’ … or ..’we need to want it more’ is pointless, worthless nonsense. We have spent Buendia on a lot of players who are better than we had before and a lot less not-as-good-as-everyone-else’s. Though we don’t have anything now to really hurt teams tactically with. ‘Both boxes’ as the old boys used to say. Our failure is a cascading collection of small weaknesses and inter-connecting sticking plasters to cover the gaping wound of lack of finance. All of it is understandable. If we really want to ‘do different’ it is time to reach out to the SME world, to the Tifosys trading ground bond supporters, small investors, loyal individuals and create a genuinely inclusive French-Shared-Mortgage model whereby the small slices of ownership fluctuate according to investment size at any given moment. Whereby any small (vetted) investor gets a marketing share of brand usage, whereby the community and collective spirit is honourably leveraged to create a membership-style model that would truly be a fitting legacy to Delia’s wonderful era. She herself could and should be a major part going forwards. Like it or not, intended or not, the club has become a massively appreciated asset. It’s value has increased maybe tenfold from the very welcome, though contextually small investment of (anecdotally) £10m or less. The majority of the £100m is now Delia’s. She can hand it down to Tom. He can keep it or cash it in. Maybe it is a theoretical £100m that never sees the light of day. If you ask for that money from an investor, I would be reasonably sure it would never materialise. The ‘doors are open’ offer to sell is thus a somewhat theoretical one. It also would have no benefit to Norwich City. Not a pound would enter the club from such a share sale. Something of a circular reference self-fulfilling prophecy then…. ..and so we have 20 odd good players and no Buendia. Nor any Skipp. Nor any points. Not really an accident at all. Parma

Yes, not the greatest start to the season but really is it that bad. Bad enough to want Farke pushed out the door. Just remember what this man and his team have done for the club and where we are now compared to 4 years ago. I still have faith in the team, the project and more importantly Daniel Farke. We will come good and the results will follow. A small club down the road recently pushed a certain Mick McCarthy out of the door, look how that’s ended. I don’t want that happening to my club. Farke must be given time and deserves time to turn this around. Everybody needs to get behind him and the team. OTBC.

Given how it isn't unusual for some teams to have a rough start at the start of a PL season and with our mitigating circumstances of having to play Liverpool and Man City in the opening two games, the fact that we could only get some of the players we wanted very late in the transfer window, the interupted pre-season and the difficult matches after the first two, it is not so surprising we have had a bad start. And to be fair we could have had a point against Leicester, we could have had a bit more luck at Arsenal and again at Everton. It's a bad start. We all get that. No arguments there, but really, the way some people latch on to it and try and suck it dry for every bit of wallowing in it as they can is unhealthy. We all love the club, we all want the best for it, but losing the plot now is the last thing that is needed. Maybe people could try and put their egos to one side and just accept the situation for what it is, let the manager and players sort it out in training with the new players gradually settling in, dig in deep and just get behind everyone - and we might actually see something happen that we like.

We know we're not very good. You don't need to start multiple threads telling us or go trawling through every arsewipe newspaper to find snippets saying the same thing. Go and do something else.

As I write this post Arsenal are 3-0 up. Arteta was favourite for the sack a couple of weeks ago (we did help him keep his job!!!) and now could become a hero. The Arsenal fans are loving it! Something has now clicked for them. That's how quick it changes in football! There are fine margins in elite sport and we (as Norwich fans) have been this position far too many times by calling for Farke and Webber to go and each time they've come up with the answers and then all fans are back on board again! Give Farke more time ffs. At the very very least he deserves it! A couple of wins and everything will all of a sudden be fine although there's hard work to be done by all at NCFC. As the original poster says 'be careful what you wish for'.

Sacking Farke won't provide us with the DM we don't have nor the Buendia replacement. It's a pointless reaction with more long term negatives than positives.

Parma, much to agree with there. But with respect I think you oversimplify the Buendia situation. Roughly speaking, based on what looked like well-sourced estimates in the media, we had somewhere between £15m and £25m to spend without any sales. Keep Buendia, fill the Skipp gap with a Premier-League quality replacement, and that would have been the transfer budget pretty much used up.* No cover for Krul, no new defenders, no improvement on the willing but limited Hernandez, no new striker and so on. Come early November and a bit of an injury crisis and we have only Gibson available in central defence, an unfit Bryam pressed into service at fullback, and the very blunt instrument of Idah up front. Easy to imagine what the volcanic reaction of fans here would be if we found ourselves in that kind of situation. Webber and Farke are not idiots. I am sure they knew what they would be missing by selling Buendia but they felt they had no choice. As to ownership, yes, there is an alternative to either the poor but honest status quo and the cartoon-like figure of a billionaire with all eyes on the bottom line. Well over a decade ago I came up with the idea of a supporter-director with a golden share veto as part of a much more fan- and community-based model. I don't think the notion has got any less sensible or relevant to Norwich City in the intervening years. *This equation still works if we loaned in a Skipp replacement but had to spend many millions on a permanent deal for, say, a new striker.

@Parma Ham's gone mouldy Best bit of quality on this board for a long time.

Going on the assumptions that Todd is still unavailable, DF will give 3 at the back another go & that McLean will be benched, what about: Krul Hanley Kabak Gibson Aarons Rupp PLM Normann Williams Sargent Pukki 9 from Gunn, Rashica, Gilmour, Tzolis, Idah, McLean, Giannoulis, Dowell, Sorensen, Omobamidele, Mumba for options. Reasonably physical team through the middle to hopefully compete with Burnley, Rupp & Normann to cover for the wing-backs when they venture forward to support the front two, PLM to link the play, Gibson & Normann for balls over the top when Burnley push up and press & use the bench wisely to stretch the game in the second half. Hopefully another week on the training pitch will bring the lads together. No Carabao distractions. If we can somehow (?) eliminate the fundamental errors that keep getting punished, you would hope that in-game belief & confidence will improve as matches develop. One small positive to cling to: our brief patches of decent/meaningful possession and controlling games are increasing in length as the games tick by. Who knows - we may even rattle the onion bag! Burnley's home form has not been good in recent times. My towel has not been thrown in yet. OTBC! 👍

What a strange thread, a reasonable question met with a bunch of people crowbarring in their own unrelated agendas.

Oh right i see, so that statistic makes our situation of no wins, only one goal from open play and having conceded a mere 16 goals all the more acceptable ?

Can it not be both? I personally believe they saved the club in a dire time, but I also broadly agree with Parma’s assessment of where we are now. I believe Delia and Michael love the club but their good ownership unintentionally leaves us stuck within the current Football financial pyramid. I have no desire for a stinking Rich owner, but there other ways that could be explored as Parma had suggested at the acceptance of a dilution of their current ownership. We could become a model for community/supporter ownership for instance.

With all our woes recently I can’t help but just view our club as a metaphor, a shining example, why elite football in this country just doesn’t work We’ve been stuck in this championship/premier league purgatory and it doesn’t really have an end in sight. Or is there? The way out, in my opinion, is the European super league. Although it was oh-so-grand to see Gary Neville (who by the way has funded a club that has artificially blasted its way up the league unfairly because of a cash injection) and the rest crying their eyes out and going on about the “beautiful game” “anyone can be a Leicester” the bottom line is they are keeping us, and clubs like us, around for cannon fodder for the big clubs. An opponent to show the new customers on Far East Asia. Sure, you can be plucky Brentford, or even plucky Bournemouth… for a while. Even we did it! But this league catches up with you. It eats you up and spits you out. it doesn’t last, even when you think it will. this season is just a metaphor for me that we need the European super league as soon as possible so the remaining clubs can go from cannon fodder for billionaire criminal plaything clubs to creating our own brand of football. btw this is not withstanding the fact we’ve been abjectly awful in pretty much all areas since the start of this season. This isn’t that hard to explain btw. emi out, skipp out = we can’t play.

It isn't that people aren't at least interested, and some concerned. But if you start a thread with a post that contains absolutely no information or ideas then you can hardly be surprised when it doesn't create much of a debate.

When people are malcontent with their lot, they attack what they claim to love.

Are you looking for another angle to beat the club with?

I think the Palace profile has changed somewhat this season- they aren't looking for Hodgson type players any more. However I think this all slightly depends on how you interpret the question- for me Hardhouse is asking who is good enough to be a regular starter elsewhere, rather than which exact XI would this player be a fit for.

Absolutely not a cat in hells chance do either of these get into another Premier squad.

There's no way fans will stand by and allow anything approaching 15+ straight defeats!!?!....especially off the back of Farke losing his last 10 , two seasons ago, They'd be tearing the place down long before it got to that stage, let alone the poisonous atmosphere inside the stadium

I bet you're fun at parties.

Glass half-empty: Fully deserved to lose against Liverpool, Man City & Watford - well beaten. Couldn't muster even a point against an understrength Leicester, Arsenal & Everton. Look generally unthreatening up top and making embarrassing & costly errors which are getting punished. Confidence is rattled and pressure for points is cranking up. Glass half-full: Purple patches in games are getting longer, attempts at goal are increasing, new players are getting more time to bed in on the training pitch, not getting too many new injuries so far, we have genuine options & flexibility, 3 at the back looked fairly solid against Everton & might help to counterbalance our inferior midfield and lack of a number 10, i.e. play to our strengths with wing-backs. It might all go pear-shaped but for me, we need to show a bit of patience and back the lads. That elusive first point or three could help steady the ship.

We are on a model on the Auxerre-Ajax-Barcelona spectrum of long term methodology and philosophy. We will prefer players we have bred and talent we have schooled. We were incredible last year. It was a wonderful unexpected miracle. We didn’t then spend any money. Other Premier teams already had lots of money and lots of great players. Our methodology is refreshing and will maximise our chances and improve our players based on our available parameters. We either go into a gunfight with a knife or we try some innovative guerilla tactics that may not work, though which do not see Steven Naismith in the reserves, but rather see Godfrey, Aarons, Lewis, Cantwell et al receive an unbuyable education, likely enhancing their values (perhaps exponentially) and ‘proving’ to the world that we meant it when we said ‘come here (excellent young, underused player) and you’ll be given a fair chance and a great education. This way the next Maddison comes to us too. And slightly better young players are attracted than even before. And so it continues. Or you could spend a load of cash on big lads that are a bit worse than everybody else’s big lads, with money we don’t have and putting off all the young gifted players that we haven’t yet signed that are crucial to our sustainability under the current model.

I Think everyone remembers what the manger has achieved and done that's what makes it hard to dislike him despite his awful premier league record everyone wants him to turn things round but can he?

He certainly deserves time, agreed. But the performances need to inspire confidence in both players and fans sooner rather than later.

Yeah, this is pretty much how I see it. Thanks Parma, by the way, a good read and I agree with large parts of it. As Purple says though, I think Webber and Farke had to weigh up the cost benefit of keeping a wantaway Buendia vs plugging the clear gaps in the squad with a reasonable budget. That the signings may or may not be good enough is something for hindsight, they had to make the decision on the basis they believe their scouts had identified plausible options. And in all honesty I'm not sure we should be questioning the entire methodology at this stage. I say that because, even taking into account the difficult fixtures and pre season (or lack of) we have truthfully looked a bit of a shadow of our former self, even in comparison to how we started the last Premier season. Obviously confidence is going to be a huge factor particularly with new players, most of them young. Hopefully Burnley we get our first point(s) on the board in any possible way and the confidence starts to grow.

Thanks for this Parma, it was thoughtful and interesting. I don't want to go over some of the well-trodden ground again but would like to focus on some of the financial/ structural points you make. I will say at the outset that I am very attracted to the idea alternative financing methods involving fans/ bondholders/ SMEs - we have used it before. I can see it as a useful source of finance + also a way of binding the community increasingly firmly to the club (and also make us less prone to vultures in the future.) There is merit in the idea even if it did not make us "competitive" in the PL (something, I'm not convinced by). If we were to raise finance, it could no doubt be beneficial, but if you are asserting that structurally we are too short of funds to compete, surely this implies that this fund raising would need to be an annual process. I know that for each position we get £c2.5 million + it could be used to fund ground expansion which in turn would generate further revenue. Both of these things would be good - but in your opinion would that be enough? My own view is that we are not that far off a competitive revenue. If we ever manage to stay up, the second year need for new players would be lower + of course we would have earner extra performance millions from sky. It is getting through the first year or two is the challenge. If, however, you are of the opinion that we are miles short, it would seem to imply the need for ongoing bond + share issues, the former, incurring interest charges reducing some of the revenue attained. What do you think is a competitive PL revenue? (By competitive, I mean able to stay up for a few years without being nearly ruined like some clubs have been). From what I have seen, we are not that far short. (Especially when dividend and interest payments are taken into account).

Parma - that is a great , and very surprising read. Surprising as you have (apologies) stated the obvious (selling Buendia , Farke’s philosophy overcomes weaker teams) without the over complication that I have been critical of in the past. I suspect that as you have said it , it may not attract the vitriol that others may have received . I , like many in business, have fears around the Miss Haversham reference . It isn’t entirely fair , but the refusal to see any way other than the current way does seem accurate which is a pity . I’m so disappointed. I had high expectations for the seasons. I don’t follow European football so the signings meant little to me . I hoped the players were more Buendia than Heise . They may still be , but so far they are not. My analogy of Farke is a job interview / CV scenario. DF arrives for a job at a high end job in any industry. The shareholders and their directors are looking for the best person to take the organisation forward. DF opens his pitch by saying he has had exemplary success in the lower reaches of the industry or environment in question. So far so good . But when asked about his successes at the level the organisation is currently operating in , DF has to concede he has had no success. The organisation, and all of its stakeholders is faced with a fairly simple decision . Farke has grown with Norwich and vice versa . There is genuine love for him. But his demonstrable inability to compete at this level is currently in question . But a you say , this is not the main issue of why Norwich find ourselves where we are . Good , but troubling , read Parma.

It’s like you didn’t read what he wrote.

Rumour has it that Johnson is planning to release a cover version of Robin the Frog's song "Halfway Down the Stairs". He considers it to be the profoundest expression of his principled approach to politics:

Which fans ? Those that want Farke to go? those that want him to stay? Or Webber to go or stay ? Delia to go or stay? Etc etc

Perhaps Farke would be best placed as a Youth Team manager at a top club… (or a coach), rather than a first team manager / coach at a Premier League Club?!

What is with everyone keep banging on about ajer and how we shouldve signed him. Do we honestly think he would improve our back 4 that much? Like people still hung up on buendia leaving. Get over it. Move on

For a couple of seasons now Farke has been accused of not having a plan B, maybe these three players are now just that. If three at the back is the way we are going then surely it makes sense to have players on the bench that we can utilise and change the system when needed. Fans called for a plan B, then question when we have just that.

Back to the 70's themes and the UK returning there - I couldn't help but recall the C.W McCall song 'Convoy' in my mind given the current self induced list of Brexit related issues as led by today by the truckers - and 'Suicide Jockeys ' in particular! All those self induced Brexit issues now lining up to steam roller Johnson this winter - a true convoy of issues. Fuel, Gas, Food shortages (even hogs), staff shortages in NHS (some chemo cancelled) , cares homes and on and on - wow what a convoy of troubles! I'm sure some wag can alter the lyrics appropriately!

My sentiments. We’re not good defensively so let’s have some fun. We spent millions on wingers, let them have a go. Great comments from TK. Top keeper, top man.

How about we don’t get rid, how about we just all do the unexpected, get behind the players and coaches regardless and give them the support they desperately need. It’s reasonable to appreciate that losing Emi and Ollie, then having to integrate 7 or 8 new players plus the start - this was always a very difficult task… we have to help the team… getting behind them is likely to get us results much sooner than moaning and criticising. We’ve come this far, may as well stick with it and hope DF learns quicker and gets more pragmatic.

Would that be the audit that actually was a recount and found that Trump lost by more votes than orignially declared? https://www.unilad.co.uk/news/trump-mocked-after-stop-the-steal-funded-recount-finds-he-lost-by-bigger-margin/ Trump Mocked After ‘Stop The Steal’ Funded Recount Finds He Lost By Bigger Margin The audit that was ordered by the Republican run senate with the result that its Republican leader now accepts Trump was defeated fair and square: Arizona Senate President Karen Fann, the Republican who paved the way for the so-called "full forensic audit" of 2.1 million ballots in Maricopa County, said the review's overall vote tally matched the initial results in November. "Truth is truth, numbers are numbers," Fann said at a Senate hearing on the review, which found only small variations, yielding 99 additional votes for Biden and 261 fewer votes for Trump. "Those numbers were close, within a few hundred." "Ben Ginsberg, a longtime Republican election lawyer who represented Republican George W. Bush when he prevailed over Democrat Al Gore in a 2000 electoral dispute, called the review's conclusions a "huge defeat" for Trump. "This was Donald Trump's best chance to prove his cases of elections being rigged and fraudulent and they failed," Ginsberg said on a media call organized by the States United Democracy Center, a nonpartisan policy group." https://www.reuters.com/world/us/arizona-republicans-release-findings-widely-panned-election-audit-2021-09-24/ Hilariously, bringing further attention upon his sociopathic delusional state of mind, Trump described this personal defeat as, "a big win for democracy and a big win for us." Couldn't agree more with the first clause of that sentence, but perhaps that second clause explains why he still thinks he won. Could someone please explain to him that getting fewer votes than your opponent means you've lost.

You have to be immensely naïve or cinincal to believe or comment that the “audit” was about anything other than undermining confidence in elections so the far right can complete their coup - maybe not now i.e. 2021, but in 2024.

We just needed to continue the improvement rather than ripping it up and starting again. Investing in the squad should mean we're able to do the same thing better. In 19/20 we were ravaged by injuries as well as having horrendous luck with officials and VAR. I know it was awful after the restart but we weren't all that far away. The squad at the end of 20/21 was massively improved over the 19/20 players with Dowell, Gibson and Giannoulis brought in and many individuals reaching new levels. I was fine with selling Buendia. The fee was astronomical and I couldn't envisage multiple ~ £10m signings failing to improve our attack. But I couldn't imagine the midfield being so tactically compromised. We needed a single, quality replacement for Skipp. Instead we've brought in PLM and Gilmour and destroyed our balance completely. We've gone from having a double pivot of two positionally disciplined CDMs to having 3 CMs who are all over the place and a weakened attack in front of them. The only hope is that Normann can become a reliable CDM and that Gilmour miraculously learns how to read the game when we don't have the ball. We've built our success on having 4 attacking players who can tear teams apart through rapid transitions - creating and exploiting overloads, pressing and winning the ball back high and quickly. We've inexplicably abandoned that and now we offer nothing at all.

I very much admire his unbreakable optimism. This place can get pretty depressing when things aren't going well so at least he's always being positive

Here's a ridiculous idea: remember when we used to win games almost every week? How about we do the things that we did back in those glory-days? Krul Aarons Omibamedele Hanley Giannoulis Normann McLean Tzolis Dowell Cantwell Pukki If I see some kind of combination of Lees-Melou, Gilmour, Williams or Rashica in the starting lineup again or anything resembling a 3 man midfield, I'm going to lose my sh*t. These players are not familiar with how we play when we're actually winning.

If Normann's injured you'd like to think Sorenson might be considered, as we did buy him as a CDM. For whatever reason Farke isn't tho, and disappointingly, Rupp and Mclean are always preferred ahead, regardless of their performances (and add to that Gilmour & PLM) so unless we have another injury crisis can't see Sorenson playing (unless he really steps up his game in training) It's baffling what's going on behind the scenes with Sorenson as he's always looked accomplished when he's played in CDM, or LB

I don't think Farke realizes Sorenson is a part of his squad.

And what about Sorenson for McLean

A quick explainer on how the EU logistics model worked and how Brexit barriers have crippled us. A Romanian registered truck would pick up stuff from Italy, bound for the UK. It would then pick up stuff in the UK, bound for another drop in the UK or back to Europe. Their profit relied on quick turnaround and especially little to no border checks. Freedom of movement so to speak. This way freed up domestic drivers to do local, domestic deliveries, which we had just enough to do this job. Now there are border checks these logistic companies will not take on jobs bound for the UK. Which also means no more extra pick ups. So our own drivers have to pick up the slack. This has stretched our domestic logistic firms to breaking point. It's all in the details and the RHA and logistic firms have been shouting and warning about this for a long time. The fact you failed to heed the warnings, or pooh-poohed them as project fear are your own fault. Listen next time.

What does much as a moral one as financial mean? Particularly referencing the ‘moral’ bit! Who said their heart isn’t really in the EPL? We are (and have to) do it our way. Exactly how is the club compromised by S&J? This should be good! Not expecting a response but fair play in advance if you can offer constructive reasoning! Would also like to ask what the end game is you refer to as I’m thinking there is no intentional end game, the philosophy is just to improve and see where it leads.

As I've consistently posted elsewhere, the clubs position is much as a moral one, as financial. Their heart isn't really in the EPL, so apart from taking T.V money and parachute payments, they are comfortable being a second tier team - whether the fans like that, or not. They know the fans won't stop going, so in that respect, Norwich City heavily take their fans for granted. There is nothing wrong with selling players for a profit - all teams do it - but once the parachute payments run out, selling our best players may not be enough. The club is totally compromised by Smith & Jones ownership and ethos and we are currently playing out an extremely long end game that will not end well.

Blame isn't the right word as we should all be in this together but the buck stops at the top in ensuring we are all in it together. A poll such as this isn't valuable as football supporters are conditioned to blame the manager/coach. Board members should have been working with local businesses much like they did when we signed Darren Huckerby to ensure that team strengthening funds were available at the right time to enable proper planning prior to the seasons start.

Something like this possibly although requires Todd to be available. Really not sure on the two midfielders, I'm not entirely sure we have a two that works, which may be why Farke is insistent on a three. As a two, they'd probably be my pick.